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Hot water/ wood stove heating systems

 
Lily o' the Valley

User ID: 70848385
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01/01/2017 03:33 PM

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Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I'm posting things we have done to prompt discussion, and to not hijack the Alaska wood stove thread.



We built a system in a house that heated water in pipes that ran alongside a wood stove, with a metal shield over the coils to prevent heat lost. My husband ran the heated water into a hot water heater placed higher than the wood stove, As soon as we did that our electrical bill plummeted and we had a lot more hot water. We did not need to do anything to improve over the heating we already had from the stove. Worked by convection = hot water rises, cool water sinks.

We are designing a system like that for a new place we are working on that will heat a couple of small radiators too. Radiators first on line because they have pressure release built in, then hot water heater next, then back to the stove. We may augment with a small solar charged water pump if needed.

We had another place in which we poured cement floors with copper pipes embedded it them for radiant heat. It was run with a pump that ran warmed h2o from a similar setup. However, my husband ran the water into a tank and then into the floor pipes, and we had too big a tank, so we could not heat water fast enough. We were going to put glass bricks into the tank to reduce the volume of h2o to be heated, but sold the place before we got that done. I still think that it might work, but use a smaller tank, elevated higher than the output pipe on the stove side.

The house we are in now has pipes actually through the firebox of an old wood stove in the basement. When the weather is really cold, I start a fire, put one medium sized piece of firewood on it and let it burn, and then burn out. Wonderful, really hot water for the day.
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Lily o' the Valley  (OP)

User ID: 70848385
United States
01/01/2017 03:35 PM

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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I'm posting things we have done to prompt discussion, and to not hijack the Alaska wood stove thread.



We built a system in a house that heated water in pipes that ran alongside a wood stove, with a metal shield over the coils to prevent heat lost. My husband ran the heated water into a hot water heater placed higher than the wood stove, As soon as we did that our electrical bill plummeted and we had a lot more hot water. We did not need to do anything to improve over the heating we already had from the stove. Worked by convection = hot water rises, cool water sinks.

We are designing a system like that for a new place we are working on that will heat a couple of small radiators too. Radiators first on line because they have pressure release built in, then hot water heater next, then back to the stove. We may augment with a small solar charged water pump if needed.

We had another place in which we poured cement floors with copper pipes embedded it them for radiant heat. It was run with a pump that ran warmed h2o from a similar setup. However, my husband ran the water into a tank and then into the floor pipes, and we had too big a tank, so we could not heat water fast enough. We were going to put glass bricks into the tank to reduce the volume of h2o to be heated, but sold the place before we got that done. I still think that it might work, but use a smaller tank, elevated higher than the output pipe on the stove side.

The house we are in now has pipes actually through the firebox of an old wood stove in the basement. When the weather is really cold, I start a fire, put one medium sized piece of firewood on it and let it burn, and then burn out. Wonderful, really hot water for the day.
 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley


I would like to hear what other people have done.

We are looking right now at using one of those little ammo can wood stoves to heat a bathroom and hot water. This might be a possibility that would replace the need for a lot of plumbing, and be easily fired by scrap wood.
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Anonymous Coward
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United States
01/01/2017 03:41 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
Interesting. I saved some late 1800s-early 1900s radiators for room heating but not for how you've done it. You can buy a heating element that fits into the original water supply line, fill them with coolant and plug/wire them in. Looks cool and works well.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
01/01/2017 03:47 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I'm posting things we have done to prompt discussion, and to not hijack the Alaska wood stove thread.



We built a system in a house that heated water in pipes that ran alongside a wood stove, with a metal shield over the coils to prevent heat lost. My husband ran the heated water into a hot water heater placed higher than the wood stove, As soon as we did that our electrical bill plummeted and we had a lot more hot water. We did not need to do anything to improve over the heating we already had from the stove. Worked by convection = hot water rises, cool water sinks.

We are designing a system like that for a new place we are working on that will heat a couple of small radiators too. Radiators first on line because they have pressure release built in, then hot water heater next, then back to the stove. We may augment with a small solar charged water pump if needed.

We had another place in which we poured cement floors with copper pipes embedded it them for radiant heat. It was run with a pump that ran warmed h2o from a similar setup. However, my husband ran the water into a tank and then into the floor pipes, and we had too big a tank, so we could not heat water fast enough. We were going to put glass bricks into the tank to reduce the volume of h2o to be heated, but sold the place before we got that done. I still think that it might work, but use a smaller tank, elevated higher than the output pipe on the stove side.

The house we are in now has pipes actually through the firebox of an old wood stove in the basement. When the weather is really cold, I start a fire, put one medium sized piece of firewood on it and let it burn, and then burn out. Wonderful, really hot water for the day.
 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley


Just insulate the tank from heat loss.
better too slow water heating than too fast, steam is a powerfull explosive force, even with a pressure relief valve it is possible to overpressure the system and get blown through a wall or two.
Anonymous Coward
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01/01/2017 03:49 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I just put plastic jugs full of water on tbe stove.
5 gallon for washing, 1 gallon one for showers.
Anonymous Coward
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01/01/2017 03:54 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I just put plastic jugs full of water on tbe stove.
5 gallon for washing, 1 gallon one for showers.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


Wut?
Anonymous Coward
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01/01/2017 03:58 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
For small space temporary heating for a small room you can place a number gallon jugs full of near boiling water in the bathroom or use hotter steel masses on a fireproof shelf or trivet after heating them up to 200 or 300 degree temp on a wood stove. The room should warm up in 10 minutes with the right number and stay warm for about a half hour or more.
Anonymous Coward
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01/01/2017 04:00 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I just put plastic jugs full of water on tbe stove.
5 gallon for washing, 1 gallon one for showers.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


Wut?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28260664


I get 5 gal jugs from quarter car washes.
they warm up nicely but you have to keep the contact temp under 200 degree as polyethylene melts at about 330 degrees.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 73671735
Australia
01/01/2017 04:00 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
We had another place in which we poured cement floors with copper pipes embedded it them for radiant heat. It was run with a pump that ran warmed h2o from a similar setup. However, my husband ran the water into a tank and then into the floor pipes, and we had too big a tank, so we could not heat water fast enough. We were going to put glass bricks into the tank to reduce the volume of h2o to be heated, but sold the place before we got that done. I still think that it might work, but use a smaller tank, elevated higher than the output pipe on the stove side.

 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley


Don't need to do this anymore this is 40yo stuff just put styrofoam in the slab.
Anonymous Coward
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01/01/2017 04:05 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
We had another place in which we poured cement floors with copper pipes embedded it them for radiant heat. It was run with a pump that ran warmed h2o from a similar setup. However, my husband ran the water into a tank and then into the floor pipes, and we had too big a tank, so we could not heat water fast enough. We were going to put glass bricks into the tank to reduce the volume of h2o to be heated, but sold the place before we got that done. I still think that it might work, but use a smaller tank, elevated higher than the output pipe on the stove side.

 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley


Don't need to do this anymore this is 40yo stuff just put styrofoam in the slab.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73671735


That depends on the prevailing ambient contact temps and the rest of the insulation package.
January Wolves

User ID: 72988822
United States
01/01/2017 04:07 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
My husband did something similar in a home we had by Yosemite. Besides just running the water pipe under the wood stove and directly back to the water heater he also ran the pipe through walls of bedrooms & other rooms the wood stove didn't heat very well. He then put openings in the walls by the pipes with small fans to blow the heat out into the rooms. It worked great.
Lily o' the Valley  (OP)

User ID: 70848385
United States
01/01/2017 04:12 PM

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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
We had another place in which we poured cement floors with copper pipes embedded it them for radiant heat. It was run with a pump that ran warmed h2o from a similar setup. However, my husband ran the water into a tank and then into the floor pipes, and we had too big a tank, so we could not heat water fast enough. We were going to put glass bricks into the tank to reduce the volume of h2o to be heated, but sold the place before we got that done. I still think that it might work, but use a smaller tank, elevated higher than the output pipe on the stove side.

 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley


Don't need to do this anymore this is 40yo stuff just put styrofoam in the slab.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73671735


That depends on the prevailing ambient contact temps and the rest of the insulation package.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


There have been -50 below in winter at that place, the ground freezes deep. This place was only used on weekend, so even with insulation, water froze in the house in the rooms that did not get direct sunlight through the windows.

Styrofoam would be a poor solution in this case, heat needs to be generated and stored in the heat sink of the floor.
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Lily o' the Valley  (OP)

User ID: 70848385
United States
01/01/2017 04:14 PM

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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
Interesting. I saved some late 1800s-early 1900s radiators for room heating but not for how you've done it. You can buy a heating element that fits into the original water supply line, fill them with coolant and plug/wire them in. Looks cool and works well.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28260664


Nice idea. I wish I could find a couple of those old radiators for this place. We have 1/2 house with old radiatora, 1/2 with newer ones, which are not very good heaters.
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Lily o' the Valley  (OP)

User ID: 70848385
United States
01/01/2017 04:15 PM

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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
My husband did something similar in a home we had by Yosemite. Besides just running the water pipe under the wood stove and directly back to the water heater he also ran the pipe through walls of bedrooms & other rooms the wood stove didn't heat very well. He then put openings in the walls by the pipes with small fans to blow the heat out into the rooms. It worked great.
 Quoting: January Wolves


Very good idea. I am going to remember that one!
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Lily o' the Valley  (OP)

User ID: 70848385
United States
01/01/2017 04:19 PM

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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I just put plastic jugs full of water on tbe stove.
5 gallon for washing, 1 gallon one for showers.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


Wut?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28260664


I get 5 gal jugs from quarter car washes.
they warm up nicely but you have to keep the contact temp under 200 degree as polyethylene melts at about 330 degrees.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


I use metal bucket or large stock pot. No need to worry when my husband stokes up a real heater.

However, I am at the age where I don't like to lug around a lot of water anymore. Better to get the hot water to the place where I want it.

My mother told me that she would rather live in a house with no electricity than a house with no hot running water. I sure agree with her.
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Lily o' the Valley  (OP)

User ID: 70848385
United States
01/01/2017 04:21 PM

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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
For small space temporary heating for a small room you can place a number gallon jugs full of near boiling water in the bathroom or use hotter steel masses on a fireproof shelf or trivet after heating them up to 200 or 300 degree temp on a wood stove. The room should warm up in 10 minutes with the right number and stay warm for about a half hour or more.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


As I said before, I just am at the age when I don't want to lug water around anymore. But that is good information. I have thought of heating metal mass, but again, there I go lugging stuff around.
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Anonymous Coward
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United States
01/01/2017 04:21 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I live in a cabin. I bought an hq outdoor wood stove and put double walled pipe over the flute right out the back wall. I bought a l.p. gas fired in line point of use hot water heater. Love it & Love my set up.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
01/01/2017 04:26 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
We had another place in which we poured cement floors with copper pipes embedded it them for radiant heat. It was run with a pump that ran warmed h2o from a similar setup. However, my husband ran the water into a tank and then into the floor pipes, and we had too big a tank, so we could not heat water fast enough. We were going to put glass bricks into the tank to reduce the volume of h2o to be heated, but sold the place before we got that done. I still think that it might work, but use a smaller tank, elevated higher than the output pipe on the stove side.

 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley


Don't need to do this anymore this is 40yo stuff just put styrofoam in the slab.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73671735


That depends on the prevailing ambient contact temps and the rest of the insulation package.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


There have been -50 below in winter at that place, the ground freezes deep. This place was only used on weekend, so even with insulation, water froze in the house in the rooms that did not get direct sunlight through the windows.

Styrofoam would be a poor solution in this case, heat needs to be generated and stored in the heat sink of the floor.
 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley

Thats what im saying
youre basically on an iceberg. You need to add heat


I have a similar condition
the basement floor is just above a spring bed, it keeps the floor above freezing in the winter
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 73086095
United States
01/01/2017 04:29 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
For small space temporary heating for a small room you can place a number gallon jugs full of near boiling water in the bathroom or use hotter steel masses on a fireproof shelf or trivet after heating them up to 200 or 300 degree temp on a wood stove. The room should warm up in 10 minutes with the right number and stay warm for about a half hour or more.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


As I said before, I just am at the age when I don't want to lug water around anymore. But that is good information. I have thought of heating metal mass, but again, there I go lugging stuff around.
 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley


Then duct it and use a fan to temporarily push heat from above the stove into the room, no carrying anything.
You can use the flexible insulated duct
Anonymous Coward
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United States
01/01/2017 04:32 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I love in a cabin. I bought an hq outdoor woof stove and put double walked pipe over the flute right out the back wall. I bought a l.p. gas fired in line point of use hot water heater. Love it Love my set up.
 Quoting: PoliceState2014


It wrap the the flue with Pex and use it as a preheat for your waterheater
Anonymous Coward
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United States
01/01/2017 05:02 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I love in a cabin. I bought an hq outdoor woof stove and put double walked pipe over the flute right out the back wall. I bought a l.p. gas fired in line point of use hot water heater. Love it Love my set up.
 Quoting: PoliceState2014


It wrap the the flue with Pex and use it as a preheat for your waterheater
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


If I thought of that I probably wouldn't have bought a point of use water heater, but this water gets PLENTY hot, 2.6 GPM flow. I love it. Of course I live in the south so I don't know how well it would work up yonder. also, you CANNOT let this unit freeze without draining ALL of the water out.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
01/01/2017 05:08 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I love in a cabin. I bought an hq outdoor woof stove and put double walked pipe over the flute right out the back wall. I bought a l.p. gas fired in line point of use hot water heater. Love it Love my set up.
 Quoting: PoliceState2014


It wrap the the flue with Pex and use it as a preheat for your waterheater
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


If I thought of that I probably wouldn't have bought a point of use water heater, but this water gets PLENTY hot, 2.6 GPM flow. I love it. Of course I live in the south so I don't know how well it would work up yonder. also, you CANNOT let this unit freeze without draining ALL of the water out.
 Quoting: PoliceState2014


Most of those units run a closed loop heating an A coil transfer to transfer heat using glycol freeze protection to the potable water supply and not direct from shroud to faucet.
I dont think anyone would plumb it any other way unless you did it yourself
Anonymous Coward
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United States
01/01/2017 05:14 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
Its not that you wont get lots of hot water with your point of use heater its just how much you pay to do it.
A regular plumber probably wouldn't do it for a reasonable price if at all.
you have to deal with overpressurizing the system.
its a different price to go from 60 degree water to 100 than it is to go from 80 or 90 degree to 100.
Lily o' the Valley  (OP)

User ID: 70848385
United States
01/01/2017 05:17 PM

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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
...


Don't need to do this anymore this is 40yo stuff just put styrofoam in the slab.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73671735


That depends on the prevailing ambient contact temps and the rest of the insulation package.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


There have been -50 below in winter at that place, the ground freezes deep. This place was only used on weekend, so even with insulation, water froze in the house in the rooms that did not get direct sunlight through the windows.

Styrofoam would be a poor solution in this case, heat needs to be generated and stored in the heat sink of the floor.
 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley

Thats what im saying
youre basically on an iceberg. You need to add heat


I have a similar condition
the basement floor is just above a spring bed, it keeps the floor above freezing in the winter
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


Yes, I am just expanding on what you said. Styrofoam can keep cold in too! LOL
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Lily o' the Valley  (OP)

User ID: 70848385
United States
01/01/2017 05:19 PM

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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
For small space temporary heating for a small room you can place a number gallon jugs full of near boiling water in the bathroom or use hotter steel masses on a fireproof shelf or trivet after heating them up to 200 or 300 degree temp on a wood stove. The room should warm up in 10 minutes with the right number and stay warm for about a half hour or more.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


As I said before, I just am at the age when I don't want to lug water around anymore. But that is good information. I have thought of heating metal mass, but again, there I go lugging stuff around.
 Quoting: Lily o' the Valley


Then duct it and use a fan to temporarily push heat from above the stove into the room, no carrying anything.
You can use the flexible insulated duct
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


That's a possibility too, to keep that room warm.
*** Good deeds bring rewards, bad actions bring troubles. That is a law of the universe. ***
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 73240262
United States
01/01/2017 05:22 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
euro/uk "solid fuel"/coal/turf ranges have had these types of systems for years already and why the hell it never picked up in the USA i cannot figure out.
you have your range cooker going basically 24/7 to begin with, hot water reservoir, pipes leading to some radiators, or simply pipes around the perimeter of a room etc.
it works as you know.
your home may not be cranked up to 70 degrees but it is cozy and dry.
what i still miss are the large hot water reservoirs behind the wall of an open firebox/small fireplace where one stores clean folded clothes in a nice warm place-the hot press.
again, nothing wasted not even some heat.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 73086095
United States
01/01/2017 05:28 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
euro/uk "solid fuel"/coal/turf ranges have had these types of systems for years already and why the hell it never picked up in the USA i cannot figure out.
you have your range cooker going basically 24/7 to begin with, hot water reservoir, pipes leading to some radiators, or simply pipes around the perimeter of a room etc.
it works as you know.
your home may not be cranked up to 70 degrees but it is cozy and dry.
what i still miss are the large hot water reservoirs behind the wall of an open firebox/small fireplace where one stores clean folded clothes in a nice warm place-the hot press.
again, nothing wasted not even some heat.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73240262


Never popular in the states cause central systems were affordable to maintain.
Europeans mostly couldnt afford the upgrade costs and getting refined petroleum fuels to a croft would be further prohibitive.
beeches

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United States
01/01/2017 05:31 PM

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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
people are working on solutions to the problem of having small portable non-combustion heat sources for heating rooms.
Liberalism is totalitarianism with a human face – Thomas Sowell
Anonymous Coward
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01/01/2017 05:35 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
I love in a cabin. I bought an hq outdoor woof stove and put double walked pipe over the flute right out the back wall. I bought a l.p. gas fired in line point of use hot water heater. Love it Love my set up.
 Quoting: PoliceState2014


It wrap the the flue with Pex and use it as a preheat for your waterheater
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


If I thought of that I probably wouldn't have bought a point of use water heater, but this water gets PLENTY hot, 2.6 GPM flow. I love it. Of course I live in the south so I don't know how well it would work up yonder. also, you CANNOT let this unit freeze without draining ALL of the water out.
 Quoting: PoliceState2014


Most of those units run a closed loop heating an A coil transfer to transfer heat using glycol freeze protection to the potable water supply and not direct from shroud to faucet.
I dont think anyone would plumb it any other way unless you did it yourself
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


strictly LP gas. Plumbed with a shut off valve and it has a drain plug. Once cannot put glycol into this unit or you void the warranty.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
01/01/2017 05:38 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
people are working on solutions to the problem of having small portable non-combustion heat sources for heating rooms.
 Quoting: beeches


Refined chemicals are expensive and unlikely to be cost effective.
Inevitably some retard will pipe up and claim you can heat a whole Siberian mansion with a shabbot candle in a flowerpot
Anonymous Coward
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01/01/2017 05:42 PM
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Re: Hot water/ wood stove heating systems
...


It wrap the the flue with Pex and use it as a preheat for your waterheater
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


If I thought of that I probably wouldn't have bought a point of use water heater, but this water gets PLENTY hot, 2.6 GPM flow. I love it. Of course I live in the south so I don't know how well it would work up yonder. also, you CANNOT let this unit freeze without draining ALL of the water out.
 Quoting: PoliceState2014


Most of those units run a closed loop heating an A coil transfer to transfer heat using glycol freeze protection to the potable water supply and not direct from shroud to faucet.
I dont think anyone would plumb it any other way unless you did it yourself
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73086095


strictly LP gas. Plumbed with a shut off valve and it has a drain plug. Once cannot put glycol into this unit or you void the warranty.
 Quoting: PoliceState2014


I have an indoor stove with a suspended water tank to preheat the gas water heater water and automstic halon extinguushers everywhere.





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