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"Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.

 
R&D scientist

User ID: 56104064
Puerto Rico
07/11/2018 03:04 PM

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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Go away commie ...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73387421


in a 99% robot run society the only thing you will have is a feudal lord and master slaver , don't be suck a fucking idiot!

Bill gates the largest CAPITALIST in the world is promoting it! as they will supplant 99% of the work force by robots in a few years ....work will vocational and voluntary for a 5 year period after that you are retired ...

a robot can produce in a day what you can produce in 100 years
so that is the mathematics ....

its keeping you alive and happy after you become OBSOLETE !!

call it whatever you want !

[link to www.cnbc.com (secure)]

the CAPITALIST bank mafia opposes it as they want you as perpetual fucking slaves!

and even have you to pay for the air you breathe!cool2
Anonymous Coward
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07/11/2018 03:12 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Sorry, but it'll never make sense in my book.
Anonymous Coward
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Serbia
07/11/2018 03:22 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
a robot can produce in a day what you can produce in 100 years
so that is the mathematics ....

its keeping you alive and happy after you become OBSOLETE !!

 Quoting: R&D scientist


nobody should be obsolete

only things that changes for human is his sense of usefulness
"what to do to be useful for society?"

well, no other animal on this planet is questioning this, why should be man be different?

even our ancestors in a cave didn't care about it. We care for this last two centuries, not more

so, this is civilization and cultural challenge and solutions have to be presented from early childhood

what's your new mission, little man? well, to learn more and more, to plant a tree and to care that water and air stay clean and to find a way to reach 10^23 planets out there in the universe... or something like that. there's always usefull job to be done.


scratching
Anonymous Coward
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07/11/2018 03:24 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
"Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669

No it doesn't.

You're trying to shift what are already far too many federal dollars in welfare entitlements to another entitlement, ostensibly disguised as 'entitlement for all', which is the OPPOSITE of entitlement.

*This* conservative mind would prefer elimination of 85% of those dollars and a working, productive population.

Math? Shuffling money around like that isn't math, it's closer to laundering. lol.
 Quoting: Fret Wiz


You're getting hung up on semantics. It isn't laundering, it's reallocating. The us government does it all the time.
Cant argue with your productivity point, but what do you suggest happens when automation occurs? In 10 years fast food restaurants will be completely roboticized. Physical retail is going the wayside of online retail. Soon, the bottom end of the economy will go belly up. What do we do then, condemn the working class to a fate worse than the gradually eroded middle class? Will we all be forced to move to other continents? Will the top class move exclusively to exports?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73424523

You are supposing that Robotics will work and replace workers, so far the opposite is true. It just shifts the jobs from non technical to technical jobs of fixing the robotics.
In many of the places you mentioned where this was tried it was a failure. Either the AI could not keep up and do the job or the Customers for the most part rejected it, as in self checkouts, ordering kiosks, etc.
So maybe it would be a factor in another 50 or 100 years.
Kingzzor

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United States
07/11/2018 03:25 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


you liberals are not gonna win. get off your lazy ass and go work.
Kingzzor
Anonymous Coward
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Canada
07/11/2018 03:29 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


Any "basic income" would be inflationary, eventually making it equal to zero $$$. Economics 101.

norespect
Anonymous Coward
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07/11/2018 03:41 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Basic Universal income will only occur if there are no jobs at all for the lower socio economic groups.

It's the bread and circuses model of social destruction.
Rome had slaves. We have illegals.

Before you start a new payment plan,get rid of the downward pressure on wages by deporting 30 million illegals.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 8695787
United States
07/11/2018 08:11 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


clappa
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 77413037
United States
03/19/2019 05:20 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


"Replaces" and "US Citizens Only." Excellent idea.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 77568734
United States
04/17/2019 12:48 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


"US CITIZENS ONLY," and I agree.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
04/17/2019 12:51 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY,"

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


racist5
Anonymous Coward
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United States
04/17/2019 12:52 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY,"

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


racist5
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2226485


And that is why Democrats will doom us all.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 76120052
United States
04/17/2019 12:58 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669

Bullshit !

It reduces the incentive to work, and replaces it with a dependence on the government. Exactly the opposite of what this country stands for.

Fuck off commie !!!
JADR+

User ID: 77547809
Australia
04/17/2019 01:12 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


Free money ... now why hasn't anyone thought of that before???

WAIT A MINUTE...... it HAS been tried before!!!!!!!!

Last Edited by JADR+ on 04/17/2019 01:13 PM
Try the steak sauce test

Thread: Steak sauce question (Mandela effect)

JADR+
Anonymous Coward
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04/17/2019 01:26 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Dependence is not independence is it?

Government wants people dependent on government, that way they can make you jump through hoops by threatening to deny you what you're dependent on. This is really basic stuff.

Why do morons, aka libtards, always, and I mean always, want to give up on freedom?
Anonymous Coward
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United States
04/17/2019 01:37 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
It'd be cheaper than the entitlements now.
It would eliminate thousands paperpusher jobs. It would eliminate waste, fraud,abuse.
Those working can choose to defer, and it is put into insured,iron clad,low yield account.
Social security cost now exceeds a trillion a year.
Welfare costs are hundreds of billions.
Snap costs a billion.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 77331063
United States
04/17/2019 01:44 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
It'd be cheaper than the entitlements now.
It would eliminate thousands paperpusher jobs. It would eliminate waste, fraud,abuse.
Those working can choose to defer, and it is put into insured,iron clad,low yield account.
Social security cost now exceeds a trillion a year.
Welfare costs are hundreds of billions.
Snap costs a billion.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76836211


We don't like your tweet, no basic income for you!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 58898333
United States
04/17/2019 01:47 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


I...I have a very coherent and cohesive rebuttal to this but my brain is feeling kind mushy right now from the ignorance of the OP's post. I think my IQ has plummeted more than half than what it was.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
04/17/2019 01:52 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
There is only ONE solution to the myriad of problems addressed in this thread.

We must all...




learn to code.
MississippiGirl

User ID: 1685967
United States
04/17/2019 02:29 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
But then again, there's that socialist disaster that just happened in Venezuela.

But that was because the elected leaders placed themselves above the economy and laundered the taxes into their own wallets. In that case, it becomes and issue of human morality rather than economic theory.

Lots of good arguments on both sides.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73424523


No there are no good arguments for a socialist economy..never has worked anywhere in the world.....EVER
Jmoore

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United States
04/17/2019 03:20 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Sure lets just get the damn show on the road, I'm tired of this slow eventual slide into the damn toilet.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
04/17/2019 03:22 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
yang gang

we need UBI now for the security of the nation and service to the common good !!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 72177819
United States
04/17/2019 03:24 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


"US CITIZENS ONLY," and I agree.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77568734


also only those not incarcerated would receive the UBI , which would be a huge incentive for deterrence of crime.
Jmoore

User ID: 20525770
United States
04/17/2019 03:25 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
That is the stupidest idea I've heard in my life. So, why work? Why should I or anyone bust their ass at work and pay taxes to pay some lazy assholes money they didn't earn? Where is any incentive to invent anything or work overtime or pay taxes or anything? You are a fucking socialist dreaming of some utopia where everything is free. Grow up.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 68538185


It doesn't have to be 100 percent socialism. Capitalism with a safety net. Hell we already have implemented socialist policies in the way of corporate subsidies.

If people aren't spending, the economy hits a plateau and then eventually degrades. UBI would allow people a small amount of money to aid with food and shelter allocation. Free up those resources, and people will be happier and more productive.

Of course, instead of UBI, we could tax the automated and put it back into welfare. But then were back to square one. UBI is the future short of national gentrification.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73424523


Oh please. Do you even realize that this would cause inflation to skyrocket so much that the people would be worse off than they were before the 1000 per month was given to them.

The best solution to low wages is to either increase the amount of people looking to hire or lower the number of people looking for work. Either of those two points will raise the wages over time because employers would be forced to compete in order to attract employees.

And do you know what the easiest way to do this would be? Get rid of all the damn illegal aliens. Round up all those fuckers, throw them in jail, shoot them whatever. And when corrupt businesses no longer have a cheap/illegal way to hire employees they will be forced to hire American's and pay decent wages.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 77512185
United States
04/17/2019 06:57 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
That is the stupidest idea I've heard in my life. So, why work? Why should I or anyone bust their ass at work and pay taxes to pay some lazy assholes money they didn't earn? Where is any incentive to invent anything or work overtime or pay taxes or anything? You are a fucking socialist dreaming of some utopia where everything is free. Grow up.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 68538185


It doesn't have to be 100 percent socialism. Capitalism with a safety net. Hell we already have implemented socialist policies in the way of corporate subsidies.

If people aren't spending, the economy hits a plateau and then eventually degrades. UBI would allow people a small amount of money to aid with food and shelter allocation. Free up those resources, and people will be happier and more productive.

Of course, instead of UBI, we could tax the automated and put it back into welfare. But then were back to square one. UBI is the future short of national gentrification.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73424523


Oh please. Do you even realize that this would cause inflation to skyrocket so much that the people would be worse off than they were before the 1000 per month was given to them.

The best solution to low wages is to either increase the amount of people looking to hire or lower the number of people looking for work. Either of those two points will raise the wages over time because employers would be forced to compete in order to attract employees.

And do you know what the easiest way to do this would be? Get rid of all the damn illegal aliens. Round up all those fuckers, throw them in jail, shoot them whatever. And when corrupt businesses no longer have a cheap/illegal way to hire employees they will be forced to hire American's and pay decent wages.
 Quoting: Jmoore


Get rid of illegals, yes. That still will not solve the automation that is replacing many middle income jobs. Or even low income jobs.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 77512185
United States
04/17/2019 07:01 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
But then again, there's that socialist disaster that just happened in Venezuela.

But that was because the elected leaders placed themselves above the economy and laundered the taxes into their own wallets. In that case, it becomes and issue of human morality rather than economic theory.

Lots of good arguments on both sides.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73424523


No there are no good arguments for a socialist economy..never has worked anywhere in the world.....EVER
 Quoting: MississippiGirl


Read the thread. This is not socialism, it is a new approach to social services and automation. This would REPLACE welfare, food stamps, social security, disability, etc, etc, and make ONE program for US Citizens ONLY. The Bureaucracy consolidation alone would pay for it.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 76973432
United States
04/17/2019 07:24 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


I don’t think it does, a basic income would mean it could provide basic things so in a place like West Virginia 1k might pay rent with enough left over for a weeks worth of groceries but in LA it would only afford a weeks worth of groceries. So then it would be unfair that 1k in rural and poor areas would be a basic income but in other areas it would be virtually nothing. So would you determine the amount based off zip code? Well now that’s unfair since some one in LA might get 2500 as basic while the guy in West Virginia is only getting 1k.

Who pays the taxes which supplies this UBI? Employers? Employees? A new payroll tax? Do people still get welfare? Do people still get social security?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 77512185
United States
04/17/2019 08:20 PM
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Re: "Universal Basic Income" makes sense even for Republicans IF they actually do the math.
Instead of just reflexively opposing a Basic Income in the US, the Republicans should actually look at the advantages.

If the new Basic Income Law is passed so that it completely REPLACES welfare payments, food stamps, Social Security payments, disability payments, and ALL other government payments, the savings in paper shuffling and bureaucracy alone would pay for the new program.

Also, by writing the new law to apply to "US Citizens ONLY," it would eliminate Billions of dollars in payments to illegals in all of those replaced programs.

A Basic Income would also increase the buying power for retailers, etc. This idea makes perfect sense from both a liberal and conservative perspective.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75011669


I don’t think it does, a basic income would mean it could provide basic things so in a place like West Virginia 1k might pay rent with enough left over for a weeks worth of groceries but in LA it would only afford a weeks worth of groceries. So then it would be unfair that 1k in rural and poor areas would be a basic income but in other areas it would be virtually nothing. So would you determine the amount based off zip code? Well now that’s unfair since some one in LA might get 2500 as basic while the guy in West Virginia is only getting 1k.

Who pays the taxes which supplies this UBI? Employers? Employees? A new payroll tax? Do people still get welfare? Do people still get social security?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76973432


LOL. People still have free choice. If they choose to live in LA, they need to make enough money to do it. Or, they can choose to move to a cheaper area. Just like now. All your other questions are already answered in this thread.