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Kratom News...

 
VigilantTexan
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02/08/2018 01:28 PM
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Kratom News...
Washington, D.C. - February 8, 2018 - Nine leading scientists in substance addiction and safety wrote to White House Opioid Crisis Team Leader Kellyanne Conway and Acting DEA Administrator Robert W. Patterson requesting they disregard the FDA's latest disinformation campaign against kratom. The scientists warned that "four surveys indicate that kratom is presently serving as a lifeline away from strong, often dangerous opioids for many of the several million Americans who use kratom. A ban on kratom that would be imposed by CSA Scheduling would put them at risk of relapse to opioid use with the potential consequence of overdose death. Similar unintended consequences are to be expected in some who would be forced to use opioids to manage acute or chronic pain."

These scientists were united in their "collective judgment that placing kratom into Schedule I will potentially increase the number of deaths of Americans caused by opioids . . ."

The nine leading scientists directly challenged the claims by FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb that kratom is an opioid by pointing out the "available science is clear that kratom, although having effects on opioid receptors in the brain, is distinct from classical opioids (e.g. morphine, heroin, oxycodone, etc.) in its chemistry, biological effects, and origin (kratom is a tree in the coffee family, not the opium poppy family). Importantly, as commonly used in raw plant form, it does not appear to produce the highly addictive euphoria or lethal respiratory depressing effects of classical opioids."

David Herman, Chairman of the AKA, called upon FDA Commissioner Gottlieb to pull back the curtain on the "black box voodoo computer model" that was unveiled by the FDA to justify their continued 'War on Kratom,' this time claiming their computer model conclusively shows kratom is an opioid, and therefore had to be banned.

"The FDA hoax on kratom is equivalent to the stunt pulled by Philip Davis, a graduate student at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a peer-reviewed journal, " Herman explained. "Davis and his colleagues used SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers. The FDA must have used the same code to generate their false report on kratom being as dangerous as opioids."

The nine respected scientists pointed out that "kratom provides a far more favorable safety profile for consumers compared to more dangerously addictive and potentially deadly classical opioid medications." They also pointed out that the FDA's solution - to file a new drug application for kratom - made no sense because "the average time and cost of new drug development is more than 10 years and 2.5 billion dollars."

The scientists also attacked the bad science the FDA used to claim deaths from kratom use, pointing out that "the fatalities that the FDA lists as having been associated with kratom include deaths with a wide variety of apparent causes in people suffering from various diseases and/or taking other substances that also likely contributed to their deaths. For example, it includes 9 fatalities in Sweden that resulted from an adulterated product that included the active substance of the prescription opioid tramadol (leading Swedish authorities to conclude that those deaths were caused by O-desmethyltramadol, not kratom).

The assertion that a scheduling recommendation can be based on a claim of deaths 'associated with kratom' rather than deaths 'caused by kratom' is not, in our judgment, either scientifically valid nor the standard that was contemplated by the U.S. Congress for the scheduling of any substance under the CSA."

Finally, the nine scientists argued that American consumers should continue to have access to kratom. "We affirm our belief that the existing science on kratom does not justify its placement into Schedule I of the CSA, nor for kratom to be added to any local or state Controlled Substances list that would effectively remove it from consumer access."

The letter and supporting documents can be found at: [link to www.americankratom.org (secure)]
El Capo

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02/08/2018 01:37 PM

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clappa
Made Member
Anonymous Coward
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02/08/2018 01:40 PM
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Well, since the entire goal of the "opioid epidemic" to increase dope sales... banning Kratom makes perfect sense.
Anonymous Coward
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02/08/2018 01:47 PM
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Kratom as a schedule one drug is just plain laughable
Anonymous Coward
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02/08/2018 01:49 PM
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Kratom as a schedule one drug is just plain laughable
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25021591


^THIS^
snarkModerator
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02/08/2018 02:03 PM

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This is war.
T For Texas, T For Tennessee!


The virtue of courage is a prerequisite for the practice of all other virtues, because otherwise one is virtuous only when virtue has no cost. There are times when something needs to be done, and yet we know that if we step up and do this needful thing, we will pay a heavy personal price. -C.S. Lewis
Lancifer

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02/08/2018 02:12 PM
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In my treating people for pain via cannameds, I always suggest they order Kratom. Cannameds work on 2 receptor sites, you might as well fill all available receptor sites. It will be great when they day comes we have every seed bearing plant available in our pharmacopoeia for use on ourselves, to heal ourselves and nourish ourselves. From the lowly coca bush to cannabis.
I have no doubt that in reality the future will be vastly more surprising than anything I can imagine. Now my own suspicion is that the Universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose. J.B.S. Haldane
Kamchatka
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02/08/2018 02:13 PM

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Five stars for you!

Not that they'll listen, of course, but it's darn sure worth a shot.


.
More deplorable all the time.
Windsage

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02/08/2018 02:21 PM
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I don't use it but if I needed it I would certainly want to be allowed to, without big pharma's greed standing in the way. No reason to make it schedule 1 drug ffs. I also don't use cannabis but glad it is available if necessary. Jeff Sessions is delusional about cannabis, there's a fight he would never win lol. Horse is out of the barn already on that one

People with control and domination issues need to be checked.

Tweeted out educational info about Kratom to my 7K followers just now.
Anonymous Coward
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02/08/2018 02:22 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Washington, D.C. - February 8, 2018 - Nine leading scientists in substance addiction and safety wrote to White House Opioid Crisis Team Leader Kellyanne Conway and Acting DEA Administrator Robert W. Patterson requesting they disregard the FDA's latest disinformation campaign against kratom. The scientists warned that "four surveys indicate that kratom is presently serving as a lifeline away from strong, often dangerous opioids for many of the several million Americans who use kratom. A ban on kratom that would be imposed by CSA Scheduling would put them at risk of relapse to opioid use with the potential consequence of overdose death. Similar unintended consequences are to be expected in some who would be forced to use opioids to manage acute or chronic pain."

These scientists were united in their "collective judgment that placing kratom into Schedule I will potentially increase the number of deaths of Americans caused by opioids . . ."

The nine leading scientists directly challenged the claims by FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb that kratom is an opioid by pointing out the "available science is clear that kratom, although having effects on opioid receptors in the brain, is distinct from classical opioids (e.g. morphine, heroin, oxycodone, etc.) in its chemistry, biological effects, and origin (kratom is a tree in the coffee family, not the opium poppy family). Importantly, as commonly used in raw plant form, it does not appear to produce the highly addictive euphoria or lethal respiratory depressing effects of classical opioids."

David Herman, Chairman of the AKA, called upon FDA Commissioner Gottlieb to pull back the curtain on the "black box voodoo computer model" that was unveiled by the FDA to justify their continued 'War on Kratom,' this time claiming their computer model conclusively shows kratom is an opioid, and therefore had to be banned.

"The FDA hoax on kratom is equivalent to the stunt pulled by Philip Davis, a graduate student at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a peer-reviewed journal, " Herman explained. "Davis and his colleagues used SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers. The FDA must have used the same code to generate their false report on kratom being as dangerous as opioids."

The nine respected scientists pointed out that "kratom provides a far more favorable safety profile for consumers compared to more dangerously addictive and potentially deadly classical opioid medications." They also pointed out that the FDA's solution - to file a new drug application for kratom - made no sense because "the average time and cost of new drug development is more than 10 years and 2.5 billion dollars."

The scientists also attacked the bad science the FDA used to claim deaths from kratom use, pointing out that "the fatalities that the FDA lists as having been associated with kratom include deaths with a wide variety of apparent causes in people suffering from various diseases and/or taking other substances that also likely contributed to their deaths. For example, it includes 9 fatalities in Sweden that resulted from an adulterated product that included the active substance of the prescription opioid tramadol (leading Swedish authorities to conclude that those deaths were caused by O-desmethyltramadol, not kratom).

The assertion that a scheduling recommendation can be based on a claim of deaths 'associated with kratom' rather than deaths 'caused by kratom' is not, in our judgment, either scientifically valid nor the standard that was contemplated by the U.S. Congress for the scheduling of any substance under the CSA."

Finally, the nine scientists argued that American consumers should continue to have access to kratom. "We affirm our belief that the existing science on kratom does not justify its placement into Schedule I of the CSA, nor for kratom to be added to any local or state Controlled Substances list that would effectively remove it from consumer access."

The letter and supporting documents can be found at: [link to www.americankratom.org (secure)]
 Quoting: VigilantTexan


I spoke with someone in the know, not my uncle, and they told me Kratom was a 4 billion dollar industry in the United States. This is too big to turn back. Plus, it definitely is lowering dope sales since it is just strong enough to prevent relapse and in turn does treat addiction.

Great source of fiber, too.
Truthserum

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02/08/2018 02:35 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Washington, D.C. - February 8, 2018 - Nine leading scientists in substance addiction and safety wrote to White House Opioid Crisis Team Leader Kellyanne Conway and Acting DEA Administrator Robert W. Patterson requesting they disregard the FDA's latest disinformation campaign against kratom. The scientists warned that "four surveys indicate that kratom is presently serving as a lifeline away from strong, often dangerous opioids for many of the several million Americans who use kratom. A ban on kratom that would be imposed by CSA Scheduling would put them at risk of relapse to opioid use with the potential consequence of overdose death. Similar unintended consequences are to be expected in some who would be forced to use opioids to manage acute or chronic pain."

These scientists were united in their "collective judgment that placing kratom into Schedule I will potentially increase the number of deaths of Americans caused by opioids . . ."

The nine leading scientists directly challenged the claims by FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb that kratom is an opioid by pointing out the "available science is clear that kratom, although having effects on opioid receptors in the brain, is distinct from classical opioids (e.g. morphine, heroin, oxycodone, etc.) in its chemistry, biological effects, and origin (kratom is a tree in the coffee family, not the opium poppy family). Importantly, as commonly used in raw plant form, it does not appear to produce the highly addictive euphoria or lethal respiratory depressing effects of classical opioids."

David Herman, Chairman of the AKA, called upon FDA Commissioner Gottlieb to pull back the curtain on the "black box voodoo computer model" that was unveiled by the FDA to justify their continued 'War on Kratom,' this time claiming their computer model conclusively shows kratom is an opioid, and therefore had to be banned.

"The FDA hoax on kratom is equivalent to the stunt pulled by Philip Davis, a graduate student at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a peer-reviewed journal, " Herman explained. "Davis and his colleagues used SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers. The FDA must have used the same code to generate their false report on kratom being as dangerous as opioids."

The nine respected scientists pointed out that "kratom provides a far more favorable safety profile for consumers compared to more dangerously addictive and potentially deadly classical opioid medications." They also pointed out that the FDA's solution - to file a new drug application for kratom - made no sense because "the average time and cost of new drug development is more than 10 years and 2.5 billion dollars."

The scientists also attacked the bad science the FDA used to claim deaths from kratom use, pointing out that "the fatalities that the FDA lists as having been associated with kratom include deaths with a wide variety of apparent causes in people suffering from various diseases and/or taking other substances that also likely contributed to their deaths. For example, it includes 9 fatalities in Sweden that resulted from an adulterated product that included the active substance of the prescription opioid tramadol (leading Swedish authorities to conclude that those deaths were caused by O-desmethyltramadol, not kratom).

The assertion that a scheduling recommendation can be based on a claim of deaths 'associated with kratom' rather than deaths 'caused by kratom' is not, in our judgment, either scientifically valid nor the standard that was contemplated by the U.S. Congress for the scheduling of any substance under the CSA."

Finally, the nine scientists argued that American consumers should continue to have access to kratom. "We affirm our belief that the existing science on kratom does not justify its placement into Schedule I of the CSA, nor for kratom to be added to any local or state Controlled Substances list that would effectively remove it from consumer access."

The letter and supporting documents can be found at: [link to www.americankratom.org (secure)]
 Quoting: VigilantTexan


Howdy Neighbor, have you tried it? I've got to find something for "old man" aches and pains. I've been doing NSAID's for years but I seriously think they are causing damage...looking for any alternative to at least try.
FACTS Don't Give a DAMN about your FEELINGS!
Ron Bananas
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Costa Rica
02/08/2018 02:40 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
This product has been a small miracle for my wife who suffers from back pain, nothing else has worked anywhere near this well.
Layers of Reality

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02/08/2018 02:51 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Washington, D.C. - February 8, 2018 - Nine leading scientists in substance addiction and safety wrote to White House Opioid Crisis Team Leader Kellyanne Conway and Acting DEA Administrator Robert W. Patterson requesting they disregard the FDA's latest disinformation campaign against kratom. The scientists warned that "four surveys indicate that kratom is presently serving as a lifeline away from strong, often dangerous opioids for many of the several million Americans who use kratom. A ban on kratom that would be imposed by CSA Scheduling would put them at risk of relapse to opioid use with the potential consequence of overdose death. Similar unintended consequences are to be expected in some who would be forced to use opioids to manage acute or chronic pain."

These scientists were united in their "collective judgment that placing kratom into Schedule I will potentially increase the number of deaths of Americans caused by opioids . . ."

The nine leading scientists directly challenged the claims by FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb that kratom is an opioid by pointing out the "available science is clear that kratom, although having effects on opioid receptors in the brain, is distinct from classical opioids (e.g. morphine, heroin, oxycodone, etc.) in its chemistry, biological effects, and origin (kratom is a tree in the coffee family, not the opium poppy family). Importantly, as commonly used in raw plant form, it does not appear to produce the highly addictive euphoria or lethal respiratory depressing effects of classical opioids."

David Herman, Chairman of the AKA, called upon FDA Commissioner Gottlieb to pull back the curtain on the "black box voodoo computer model" that was unveiled by the FDA to justify their continued 'War on Kratom,' this time claiming their computer model conclusively shows kratom is an opioid, and therefore had to be banned.

"The FDA hoax on kratom is equivalent to the stunt pulled by Philip Davis, a graduate student at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a peer-reviewed journal, " Herman explained. "Davis and his colleagues used SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers. The FDA must have used the same code to generate their false report on kratom being as dangerous as opioids."

The nine respected scientists pointed out that "kratom provides a far more favorable safety profile for consumers compared to more dangerously addictive and potentially deadly classical opioid medications." They also pointed out that the FDA's solution - to file a new drug application for kratom - made no sense because "the average time and cost of new drug development is more than 10 years and 2.5 billion dollars."

The scientists also attacked the bad science the FDA used to claim deaths from kratom use, pointing out that "the fatalities that the FDA lists as having been associated with kratom include deaths with a wide variety of apparent causes in people suffering from various diseases and/or taking other substances that also likely contributed to their deaths. For example, it includes 9 fatalities in Sweden that resulted from an adulterated product that included the active substance of the prescription opioid tramadol (leading Swedish authorities to conclude that those deaths were caused by O-desmethyltramadol, not kratom).

The assertion that a scheduling recommendation can be based on a claim of deaths 'associated with kratom' rather than deaths 'caused by kratom' is not, in our judgment, either scientifically valid nor the standard that was contemplated by the U.S. Congress for the scheduling of any substance under the CSA."

Finally, the nine scientists argued that American consumers should continue to have access to kratom. "We affirm our belief that the existing science on kratom does not justify its placement into Schedule I of the CSA, nor for kratom to be added to any local or state Controlled Substances list that would effectively remove it from consumer access."

The letter and supporting documents can be found at: [link to www.americankratom.org (secure)]
 Quoting: VigilantTexan


Howdy Neighbor, have you tried it? I've got to find something for "old man" aches and pains. I've been doing NSAID's for years but I seriously think they are causing damage...looking for any alternative to at least try.
 Quoting: Truthserum



Kratom is more than worth it. Research the strains to find what would probably work best for you.

(Green strains are oftentimes teh best starters. Specifically green maeng da from buykratombulkusa)
Anonymous Coward
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02/08/2018 03:22 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Washington, D.C. - February 8, 2018 - Nine leading scientists in substance addiction and safety wrote to White House Opioid Crisis Team Leader Kellyanne Conway and Acting DEA Administrator Robert W. Patterson requesting they disregard the FDA's latest disinformation campaign against kratom. The scientists warned that "four surveys indicate that kratom is presently serving as a lifeline away from strong, often dangerous opioids for many of the several million Americans who use kratom. A ban on kratom that would be imposed by CSA Scheduling would put them at risk of relapse to opioid use with the potential consequence of overdose death. Similar unintended consequences are to be expected in some who would be forced to use opioids to manage acute or chronic pain."

These scientists were united in their "collective judgment that placing kratom into Schedule I will potentially increase the number of deaths of Americans caused by opioids . . ."

The nine leading scientists directly challenged the claims by FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb that kratom is an opioid by pointing out the "available science is clear that kratom, although having effects on opioid receptors in the brain, is distinct from classical opioids (e.g. morphine, heroin, oxycodone, etc.) in its chemistry, biological effects, and origin (kratom is a tree in the coffee family, not the opium poppy family). Importantly, as commonly used in raw plant form, it does not appear to produce the highly addictive euphoria or lethal respiratory depressing effects of classical opioids."

David Herman, Chairman of the AKA, called upon FDA Commissioner Gottlieb to pull back the curtain on the "black box voodoo computer model" that was unveiled by the FDA to justify their continued 'War on Kratom,' this time claiming their computer model conclusively shows kratom is an opioid, and therefore had to be banned.

"The FDA hoax on kratom is equivalent to the stunt pulled by Philip Davis, a graduate student at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a peer-reviewed journal, " Herman explained. "Davis and his colleagues used SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers. The FDA must have used the same code to generate their false report on kratom being as dangerous as opioids."

The nine respected scientists pointed out that "kratom provides a far more favorable safety profile for consumers compared to more dangerously addictive and potentially deadly classical opioid medications." They also pointed out that the FDA's solution - to file a new drug application for kratom - made no sense because "the average time and cost of new drug development is more than 10 years and 2.5 billion dollars."

The scientists also attacked the bad science the FDA used to claim deaths from kratom use, pointing out that "the fatalities that the FDA lists as having been associated with kratom include deaths with a wide variety of apparent causes in people suffering from various diseases and/or taking other substances that also likely contributed to their deaths. For example, it includes 9 fatalities in Sweden that resulted from an adulterated product that included the active substance of the prescription opioid tramadol (leading Swedish authorities to conclude that those deaths were caused by O-desmethyltramadol, not kratom).

The assertion that a scheduling recommendation can be based on a claim of deaths 'associated with kratom' rather than deaths 'caused by kratom' is not, in our judgment, either scientifically valid nor the standard that was contemplated by the U.S. Congress for the scheduling of any substance under the CSA."

Finally, the nine scientists argued that American consumers should continue to have access to kratom. "We affirm our belief that the existing science on kratom does not justify its placement into Schedule I of the CSA, nor for kratom to be added to any local or state Controlled Substances list that would effectively remove it from consumer access."

The letter and supporting documents can be found at: [link to www.americankratom.org (secure)]
 Quoting: VigilantTexan


Howdy Neighbor, have you tried it? I've got to find something for "old man" aches and pains. I've been doing NSAID's for years but I seriously think they are causing damage...looking for any alternative to at least try.
 Quoting: Truthserum


I take Kratom every day. I started off by researching each strain. There are many and they can be mixed. If you're looking for pain relief, I would suggest a red strain. I've ordered from a few places but the best and purest strains I have ever gotten are from P A Botanicals. And they have always have it at my door within 3 to 4 days using regular shipping. I just placed an order for Enhanced Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1 and Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1. I get the enhanced because it it contains 10% extract. It takes 50 kilos to make 1 kilo of extract. Sara has her email listed on their web page if you should have questions. I've spoken to her a few times. She can't tell you how much to take because it violates the FDA rules. I bought a scale that measures in grams (100g by 0.01g) from Amazon and started at 1 gram and worked up to obtain the best relief. Depending on my pain, I take between 2.5 to 3.5 grams either once or twice a day. I haven't been on pain meds for nearly 3 years and I no longer feel like a slave to it. I got caught up into the game and was on opiates for nearly a decade. I wish I had found Kratom first. And when I did learn about it, it took me a couple of years to get serious about it. I wish I had not waited so long. I freed myself from prescription Oxycodone, OxyContin, and Hydrocodone. Plus, it gives more energy and a feeling of well being. I've never experienced anything negative with Kratom. You want get high or experience euphoria but you will feel the pain to go away. I've been stocking up since the FDA started their crap again. I'm looking for some Kratom plants to grow. Hope this helps. Best of luck.
Paranoiaaaaa
Butters

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02/08/2018 03:23 PM

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Re: Kratom News...
My husband recently tried kratom to help after he could no longer get hydrocodone from his neurologist.

He didn't want to go to a pain management doctor because they would probably make him go through therapy and the shots in his back just to get the meds. He has already done all that long ago and none of it helped.

He has had arthritis and degenerative disk disease in his back since his late 20's. Two of the disks in his back are just about gone. His doctor said surgery may not help and could possibly make it worse. So he's stuck with the pain. He's just turning 50 so he has a long time still to deal with it.

The kratom helps with the pain. It also gives him enough of a "buzz" to lift his mood. He uses the slow strains from Happy Hippo Herbals.
"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you." - Fox Mulder - The X-Files

"Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans." - John Lennon
Anonymous Coward
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02/08/2018 03:26 PM
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Serious question, other than "getting high", does Kratom have any medicinal purposes?
Paranoiaaaaa
Butters

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02/08/2018 03:29 PM

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Re: Kratom News...
Washington, D.C. - February 8, 2018 - Nine leading scientists in substance addiction and safety wrote to White House Opioid Crisis Team Leader Kellyanne Conway and Acting DEA Administrator Robert W. Patterson requesting they disregard the FDA's latest disinformation campaign against kratom. The scientists warned that "four surveys indicate that kratom is presently serving as a lifeline away from strong, often dangerous opioids for many of the several million Americans who use kratom. A ban on kratom that would be imposed by CSA Scheduling would put them at risk of relapse to opioid use with the potential consequence of overdose death. Similar unintended consequences are to be expected in some who would be forced to use opioids to manage acute or chronic pain."

These scientists were united in their "collective judgment that placing kratom into Schedule I will potentially increase the number of deaths of Americans caused by opioids . . ."

The nine leading scientists directly challenged the claims by FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb that kratom is an opioid by pointing out the "available science is clear that kratom, although having effects on opioid receptors in the brain, is distinct from classical opioids (e.g. morphine, heroin, oxycodone, etc.) in its chemistry, biological effects, and origin (kratom is a tree in the coffee family, not the opium poppy family). Importantly, as commonly used in raw plant form, it does not appear to produce the highly addictive euphoria or lethal respiratory depressing effects of classical opioids."

David Herman, Chairman of the AKA, called upon FDA Commissioner Gottlieb to pull back the curtain on the "black box voodoo computer model" that was unveiled by the FDA to justify their continued 'War on Kratom,' this time claiming their computer model conclusively shows kratom is an opioid, and therefore had to be banned.

"The FDA hoax on kratom is equivalent to the stunt pulled by Philip Davis, a graduate student at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a peer-reviewed journal, " Herman explained. "Davis and his colleagues used SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers. The FDA must have used the same code to generate their false report on kratom being as dangerous as opioids."

The nine respected scientists pointed out that "kratom provides a far more favorable safety profile for consumers compared to more dangerously addictive and potentially deadly classical opioid medications." They also pointed out that the FDA's solution - to file a new drug application for kratom - made no sense because "the average time and cost of new drug development is more than 10 years and 2.5 billion dollars."

The scientists also attacked the bad science the FDA used to claim deaths from kratom use, pointing out that "the fatalities that the FDA lists as having been associated with kratom include deaths with a wide variety of apparent causes in people suffering from various diseases and/or taking other substances that also likely contributed to their deaths. For example, it includes 9 fatalities in Sweden that resulted from an adulterated product that included the active substance of the prescription opioid tramadol (leading Swedish authorities to conclude that those deaths were caused by O-desmethyltramadol, not kratom).

The assertion that a scheduling recommendation can be based on a claim of deaths 'associated with kratom' rather than deaths 'caused by kratom' is not, in our judgment, either scientifically valid nor the standard that was contemplated by the U.S. Congress for the scheduling of any substance under the CSA."

Finally, the nine scientists argued that American consumers should continue to have access to kratom. "We affirm our belief that the existing science on kratom does not justify its placement into Schedule I of the CSA, nor for kratom to be added to any local or state Controlled Substances list that would effectively remove it from consumer access."

The letter and supporting documents can be found at: [link to www.americankratom.org (secure)]
 Quoting: VigilantTexan


Howdy Neighbor, have you tried it? I've got to find something for "old man" aches and pains. I've been doing NSAID's for years but I seriously think they are causing damage...looking for any alternative to at least try.
 Quoting: Truthserum


I take Kratom every day. I started off by researching each strain. There are many and they can be mixed. If you're looking for pain relief, I would suggest a red strain. I've ordered from a few places but the best and purest strains I have ever gotten are from P A Botanicals. And they have always have it at my door within 3 to 4 days using regular shipping. I just placed an order for Enhanced Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1 and Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1. I get the enhanced because it it contains 10% extract. It takes 50 kilos to make 1 kilo of extract. Sara has her email listed on their web page if you should have questions. I've spoken to her a few times. She can't tell you how much to take because it violates the FDA rules. I bought a scale that measures in grams (100g by 0.01g) from Amazon and started at 1 gram and worked up to obtain the best relief. Depending on my pain, I take between 2.5 to 3.5 grams either once or twice a day. I haven't been on pain meds for nearly 3 years and I no longer feel like a slave to it. I got caught up into the game and was on opiates for nearly a decade. I wish I had found Kratom first. And when I did learn about it, it took me a couple of years to get serious about it. I wish I had not waited so long. I freed myself from prescription Oxycodone, OxyContin, and Hydrocodone. Plus, it gives more energy and a feeling of well being. I've never experienced anything negative with Kratom. You want get high or experience euphoria but you will feel the pain to go away. I've been stocking up since the FDA started their crap again. I'm looking for some Kratom plants to grow. Hope this helps. Best of luck.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75313639


He loves the Top Shelf Bali strain( green). He also takes Bali Red and Sumatra Red. He takes about 2 gr per day. I've heard that rotating strains reduces tolerance so you don't have to keep increasing doses. So he's trying that approach.
"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you." - Fox Mulder - The X-Files

"Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans." - John Lennon
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 76225968
Costa Rica
02/08/2018 03:40 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Hi folks,

I don't come to this site very often, but my husband passed the link on to me. Thanks to OP for the article and documents.

My story - have been in outrageous pain for about 5 years. The past 2 years, my pain level is 7-8 daily. So long as I am awake, I am in serious pain. Psoas and sciatica issues.

A friend recommended Kratom and gave me a small sample of yellow and red blend. If Hell had a flavor, this would be it. But, I dissolved it in a small amount of tea and gunned it down.

Within 20 minutes, my pain level was lower than 2. First time in years. I could walk, stand up without assistance and felt like a human being.

I realize the FDA has declared a marketing war on the product and its producers. I also realize it's probably not for everyone. That said, my results have been remarkable and, since I've never been very trusting of the FDA, I intend to continue use until I've reached an acceptable level of mobility. Mobility = exercise, exercise = improved overall health.

I hope this remark is helpful to those considering Kratom as part of their pain management plan.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 75027008
United States
02/08/2018 03:46 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Kratom is currently helping me get off an opiate maintenance drug. It helps quite a bit with acute withdrawl symptoms such as insomnia, chills, restless legs. It's the only non prescription, non narcotic*? That seems to help short term. Downside is it only lasts for about 5 -6 hours and there is a bit off a anxious, jittery after effect.


I've been using 5 mg doses of green maeng dea.
Truthserum

User ID: 69911686
United States
02/08/2018 03:51 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Washington, D.C. - February 8, 2018 - Nine leading scientists in substance addiction and safety wrote to White House Opioid Crisis Team Leader Kellyanne Conway and Acting DEA Administrator Robert W. Patterson requesting they disregard the FDA's latest disinformation campaign against kratom. The scientists warned that "four surveys indicate that kratom is presently serving as a lifeline away from strong, often dangerous opioids for many of the several million Americans who use kratom. A ban on kratom that would be imposed by CSA Scheduling would put them at risk of relapse to opioid use with the potential consequence of overdose death. Similar unintended consequences are to be expected in some who would be forced to use opioids to manage acute or chronic pain."

These scientists were united in their "collective judgment that placing kratom into Schedule I will potentially increase the number of deaths of Americans caused by opioids . . ."

The nine leading scientists directly challenged the claims by FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb that kratom is an opioid by pointing out the "available science is clear that kratom, although having effects on opioid receptors in the brain, is distinct from classical opioids (e.g. morphine, heroin, oxycodone, etc.) in its chemistry, biological effects, and origin (kratom is a tree in the coffee family, not the opium poppy family). Importantly, as commonly used in raw plant form, it does not appear to produce the highly addictive euphoria or lethal respiratory depressing effects of classical opioids."

David Herman, Chairman of the AKA, called upon FDA Commissioner Gottlieb to pull back the curtain on the "black box voodoo computer model" that was unveiled by the FDA to justify their continued 'War on Kratom,' this time claiming their computer model conclusively shows kratom is an opioid, and therefore had to be banned.

"The FDA hoax on kratom is equivalent to the stunt pulled by Philip Davis, a graduate student at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a peer-reviewed journal, " Herman explained. "Davis and his colleagues used SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers. The FDA must have used the same code to generate their false report on kratom being as dangerous as opioids."

The nine respected scientists pointed out that "kratom provides a far more favorable safety profile for consumers compared to more dangerously addictive and potentially deadly classical opioid medications." They also pointed out that the FDA's solution - to file a new drug application for kratom - made no sense because "the average time and cost of new drug development is more than 10 years and 2.5 billion dollars."

The scientists also attacked the bad science the FDA used to claim deaths from kratom use, pointing out that "the fatalities that the FDA lists as having been associated with kratom include deaths with a wide variety of apparent causes in people suffering from various diseases and/or taking other substances that also likely contributed to their deaths. For example, it includes 9 fatalities in Sweden that resulted from an adulterated product that included the active substance of the prescription opioid tramadol (leading Swedish authorities to conclude that those deaths were caused by O-desmethyltramadol, not kratom).

The assertion that a scheduling recommendation can be based on a claim of deaths 'associated with kratom' rather than deaths 'caused by kratom' is not, in our judgment, either scientifically valid nor the standard that was contemplated by the U.S. Congress for the scheduling of any substance under the CSA."

Finally, the nine scientists argued that American consumers should continue to have access to kratom. "We affirm our belief that the existing science on kratom does not justify its placement into Schedule I of the CSA, nor for kratom to be added to any local or state Controlled Substances list that would effectively remove it from consumer access."

The letter and supporting documents can be found at: [link to www.americankratom.org (secure)]
 Quoting: VigilantTexan


Howdy Neighbor, have you tried it? I've got to find something for "old man" aches and pains. I've been doing NSAID's for years but I seriously think they are causing damage...looking for any alternative to at least try.
 Quoting: Truthserum


I take Kratom every day. I started off by researching each strain. There are many and they can be mixed. If you're looking for pain relief, I would suggest a red strain. I've ordered from a few places but the best and purest strains I have ever gotten are from P A Botanicals. And they have always have it at my door within 3 to 4 days using regular shipping. I just placed an order for Enhanced Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1 and Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1. I get the enhanced because it it contains 10% extract. It takes 50 kilos to make 1 kilo of extract. Sara has her email listed on their web page if you should have questions. I've spoken to her a few times. She can't tell you how much to take because it violates the FDA rules. I bought a scale that measures in grams (100g by 0.01g) from Amazon and started at 1 gram and worked up to obtain the best relief. Depending on my pain, I take between 2.5 to 3.5 grams either once or twice a day. I haven't been on pain meds for nearly 3 years and I no longer feel like a slave to it. I got caught up into the game and was on opiates for nearly a decade. I wish I had found Kratom first. And when I did learn about it, it took me a couple of years to get serious about it. I wish I had not waited so long. I freed myself from prescription Oxycodone, OxyContin, and Hydrocodone. Plus, it gives more energy and a feeling of well being. I've never experienced anything negative with Kratom. You want get high or experience euphoria but you will feel the pain to go away. I've been stocking up since the FDA started their crap again. I'm looking for some Kratom plants to grow. Hope this helps. Best of luck.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75313639


Wow..thanks for that lengthy and in-depth help. I have saved your information so that I can use it to move forward. Thanks again.
FACTS Don't Give a DAMN about your FEELINGS!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 75313639
United States
02/08/2018 03:51 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Washington, D.C. - February 8, 2018 - Nine leading scientists in substance addiction and safety wrote to White House Opioid Crisis Team Leader Kellyanne Conway and Acting DEA Administrator Robert W. Patterson requesting they disregard the FDA's latest disinformation campaign against kratom. The scientists warned that "four surveys indicate that kratom is presently serving as a lifeline away from strong, often dangerous opioids for many of the several million Americans who use kratom. A ban on kratom that would be imposed by CSA Scheduling would put them at risk of relapse to opioid use with the potential consequence of overdose death. Similar unintended consequences are to be expected in some who would be forced to use opioids to manage acute or chronic pain."

These scientists were united in their "collective judgment that placing kratom into Schedule I will potentially increase the number of deaths of Americans caused by opioids . . ."

The nine leading scientists directly challenged the claims by FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb that kratom is an opioid by pointing out the "available science is clear that kratom, although having effects on opioid receptors in the brain, is distinct from classical opioids (e.g. morphine, heroin, oxycodone, etc.) in its chemistry, biological effects, and origin (kratom is a tree in the coffee family, not the opium poppy family). Importantly, as commonly used in raw plant form, it does not appear to produce the highly addictive euphoria or lethal respiratory depressing effects of classical opioids."

David Herman, Chairman of the AKA, called upon FDA Commissioner Gottlieb to pull back the curtain on the "black box voodoo computer model" that was unveiled by the FDA to justify their continued 'War on Kratom,' this time claiming their computer model conclusively shows kratom is an opioid, and therefore had to be banned.

"The FDA hoax on kratom is equivalent to the stunt pulled by Philip Davis, a graduate student at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a peer-reviewed journal, " Herman explained. "Davis and his colleagues used SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers. The FDA must have used the same code to generate their false report on kratom being as dangerous as opioids."

The nine respected scientists pointed out that "kratom provides a far more favorable safety profile for consumers compared to more dangerously addictive and potentially deadly classical opioid medications." They also pointed out that the FDA's solution - to file a new drug application for kratom - made no sense because "the average time and cost of new drug development is more than 10 years and 2.5 billion dollars."

The scientists also attacked the bad science the FDA used to claim deaths from kratom use, pointing out that "the fatalities that the FDA lists as having been associated with kratom include deaths with a wide variety of apparent causes in people suffering from various diseases and/or taking other substances that also likely contributed to their deaths. For example, it includes 9 fatalities in Sweden that resulted from an adulterated product that included the active substance of the prescription opioid tramadol (leading Swedish authorities to conclude that those deaths were caused by O-desmethyltramadol, not kratom).

The assertion that a scheduling recommendation can be based on a claim of deaths 'associated with kratom' rather than deaths 'caused by kratom' is not, in our judgment, either scientifically valid nor the standard that was contemplated by the U.S. Congress for the scheduling of any substance under the CSA."

Finally, the nine scientists argued that American consumers should continue to have access to kratom. "We affirm our belief that the existing science on kratom does not justify its placement into Schedule I of the CSA, nor for kratom to be added to any local or state Controlled Substances list that would effectively remove it from consumer access."

The letter and supporting documents can be found at: [link to www.americankratom.org (secure)]
 Quoting: VigilantTexan


Howdy Neighbor, have you tried it? I've got to find something for "old man" aches and pains. I've been doing NSAID's for years but I seriously think they are causing damage...looking for any alternative to at least try.
 Quoting: Truthserum


I take Kratom every day. I started off by researching each strain. There are many and they can be mixed. If you're looking for pain relief, I would suggest a red strain. I've ordered from a few places but the best and purest strains I have ever gotten are from P A Botanicals. And they have always have it at my door within 3 to 4 days using regular shipping. I just placed an order for Enhanced Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1 and Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1. I get the enhanced because it it contains 10% extract. It takes 50 kilos to make 1 kilo of extract. Sara has her email listed on their web page if you should have questions. I've spoken to her a few times. She can't tell you how much to take because it violates the FDA rules. I bought a scale that measures in grams (100g by 0.01g) from Amazon and started at 1 gram and worked up to obtain the best relief. Depending on my pain, I take between 2.5 to 3.5 grams either once or twice a day. I haven't been on pain meds for nearly 3 years and I no longer feel like a slave to it. I got caught up into the game and was on opiates for nearly a decade. I wish I had found Kratom first. And when I did learn about it, it took me a couple of years to get serious about it. I wish I had not waited so long. I freed myself from prescription Oxycodone, OxyContin, and Hydrocodone. Plus, it gives more energy and a feeling of well being. I've never experienced anything negative with Kratom. You want get high or experience euphoria but you will feel the pain to go away. I've been stocking up since the FDA started their crap again. I'm looking for some Kratom plants to grow. Hope this helps. Best of luck.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75313639


He loves the Top Shelf Bali strain( green). He also takes Bali Red and Sumatra Red. He takes about 2 gr per day. I've heard that rotating strains reduces tolerance so you don't have to keep increasing doses. So he's trying that approach.
 Quoting: Paranoiaaaaa


Does the green helps his pain? I haven't tried gren for pain since the red strains help a lot. I tried the Bali Red and it helped but not has much as the Red Maeng Da. I haven't tried the Red Sumatra either. I do have some green and white in 1 oz sample packs that I never tried. From what I gather, those strains are for mood and ADHD. I may just try them to see how well it does. And I agree on mixing up the strains. I have 3 strains that I go between. Your husband sounds like he didn't want to go around the ringer. Mine injury was from the military plus I have DDD in my spine. I've done all the shots and therapy and for some stupid reason they continue to believe it will help. It's just an excuse because they're now scared shitless to write a prescription. Most will not even write a prescription for it unless your on insurance. They don't like cash payments when it comes to opiate prescriptions. Thankfully, the VA did all mine. It really is a PITA to stay in that game. I'm so glad I'm out of that game. It became pure hell. As they tightened down, it was get harder to get and even getting a prescription filled. It's not like they didn't know that I had rods and screws down my back. It's just stupid and this is why the FDA needs to BTFO from those who want to do the right thing for themselves.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 74989850
United States
02/08/2018 03:52 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Serious question, other than "getting high", does Kratom have any medicinal purposes?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35676288


It may have. But a majority of the people using it justify its abuse by saying so.

If you are taking anything "to just get high" then you are abusing the substance......Not what it was intended for.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 75313639
United States
02/08/2018 03:53 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Hi folks,

I don't come to this site very often, but my husband passed the link on to me. Thanks to OP for the article and documents.

My story - have been in outrageous pain for about 5 years. The past 2 years, my pain level is 7-8 daily. So long as I am awake, I am in serious pain. Psoas and sciatica issues.

A friend recommended Kratom and gave me a small sample of yellow and red blend. If Hell had a flavor, this would be it. But, I dissolved it in a small amount of tea and gunned it down.

Within 20 minutes, my pain level was lower than 2. First time in years. I could walk, stand up without assistance and felt like a human being.

I realize the FDA has declared a marketing war on the product and its producers. I also realize it's probably not for everyone. That said, my results have been remarkable and, since I've never been very trusting of the FDA, I intend to continue use until I've reached an acceptable level of mobility. Mobility = exercise, exercise = improved overall health.

I hope this remark is helpful to those considering Kratom as part of their pain management plan.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76225968


Isn't it great to get mobility back and have energy. Great to hear. Love stories like this.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 75313639
United States
02/08/2018 03:53 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Serious question, other than "getting high", does Kratom have any medicinal purposes?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35676288


It may have. But a majority of the people using it justify its abuse by saying so.

If you are taking anything "to just get high" then you are abusing the substance......Not what it was intended for.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 74989850


Like tide pods? lol
Alhanna

User ID: 73567860
United States
02/08/2018 03:53 PM

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Re: Kratom News...
bump
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
They must tell us what they do
Even if we understand not the message
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 75313639
United States
02/08/2018 03:59 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Washington, D.C. - February 8, 2018 - Nine leading scientists in substance addiction and safety wrote to White House Opioid Crisis Team Leader Kellyanne Conway and Acting DEA Administrator Robert W. Patterson requesting they disregard the FDA's latest disinformation campaign against kratom. The scientists warned that "four surveys indicate that kratom is presently serving as a lifeline away from strong, often dangerous opioids for many of the several million Americans who use kratom. A ban on kratom that would be imposed by CSA Scheduling would put them at risk of relapse to opioid use with the potential consequence of overdose death. Similar unintended consequences are to be expected in some who would be forced to use opioids to manage acute or chronic pain."

These scientists were united in their "collective judgment that placing kratom into Schedule I will potentially increase the number of deaths of Americans caused by opioids . . ."

The nine leading scientists directly challenged the claims by FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb that kratom is an opioid by pointing out the "available science is clear that kratom, although having effects on opioid receptors in the brain, is distinct from classical opioids (e.g. morphine, heroin, oxycodone, etc.) in its chemistry, biological effects, and origin (kratom is a tree in the coffee family, not the opium poppy family). Importantly, as commonly used in raw plant form, it does not appear to produce the highly addictive euphoria or lethal respiratory depressing effects of classical opioids."

David Herman, Chairman of the AKA, called upon FDA Commissioner Gottlieb to pull back the curtain on the "black box voodoo computer model" that was unveiled by the FDA to justify their continued 'War on Kratom,' this time claiming their computer model conclusively shows kratom is an opioid, and therefore had to be banned.

"The FDA hoax on kratom is equivalent to the stunt pulled by Philip Davis, a graduate student at Cornell University in Ithaca, New York, who got a nonsensical computer-generated paper accepted for publication in a peer-reviewed journal, " Herman explained. "Davis and his colleagues used SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers. The FDA must have used the same code to generate their false report on kratom being as dangerous as opioids."

The nine respected scientists pointed out that "kratom provides a far more favorable safety profile for consumers compared to more dangerously addictive and potentially deadly classical opioid medications." They also pointed out that the FDA's solution - to file a new drug application for kratom - made no sense because "the average time and cost of new drug development is more than 10 years and 2.5 billion dollars."

The scientists also attacked the bad science the FDA used to claim deaths from kratom use, pointing out that "the fatalities that the FDA lists as having been associated with kratom include deaths with a wide variety of apparent causes in people suffering from various diseases and/or taking other substances that also likely contributed to their deaths. For example, it includes 9 fatalities in Sweden that resulted from an adulterated product that included the active substance of the prescription opioid tramadol (leading Swedish authorities to conclude that those deaths were caused by O-desmethyltramadol, not kratom).

The assertion that a scheduling recommendation can be based on a claim of deaths 'associated with kratom' rather than deaths 'caused by kratom' is not, in our judgment, either scientifically valid nor the standard that was contemplated by the U.S. Congress for the scheduling of any substance under the CSA."

Finally, the nine scientists argued that American consumers should continue to have access to kratom. "We affirm our belief that the existing science on kratom does not justify its placement into Schedule I of the CSA, nor for kratom to be added to any local or state Controlled Substances list that would effectively remove it from consumer access."

The letter and supporting documents can be found at: [link to www.americankratom.org (secure)]
 Quoting: VigilantTexan


Howdy Neighbor, have you tried it? I've got to find something for "old man" aches and pains. I've been doing NSAID's for years but I seriously think they are causing damage...looking for any alternative to at least try.
 Quoting: Truthserum


I take Kratom every day. I started off by researching each strain. There are many and they can be mixed. If you're looking for pain relief, I would suggest a red strain. I've ordered from a few places but the best and purest strains I have ever gotten are from P A Botanicals. And they have always have it at my door within 3 to 4 days using regular shipping. I just placed an order for Enhanced Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1 and Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1. I get the enhanced because it it contains 10% extract. It takes 50 kilos to make 1 kilo of extract. Sara has her email listed on their web page if you should have questions. I've spoken to her a few times. She can't tell you how much to take because it violates the FDA rules. I bought a scale that measures in grams (100g by 0.01g) from Amazon and started at 1 gram and worked up to obtain the best relief. Depending on my pain, I take between 2.5 to 3.5 grams either once or twice a day. I haven't been on pain meds for nearly 3 years and I no longer feel like a slave to it. I got caught up into the game and was on opiates for nearly a decade. I wish I had found Kratom first. And when I did learn about it, it took me a couple of years to get serious about it. I wish I had not waited so long. I freed myself from prescription Oxycodone, OxyContin, and Hydrocodone. Plus, it gives more energy and a feeling of well being. I've never experienced anything negative with Kratom. You want get high or experience euphoria but you will feel the pain to go away. I've been stocking up since the FDA started their crap again. I'm looking for some Kratom plants to grow. Hope this helps. Best of luck.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75313639


Wow..thanks for that lengthy and in-depth help. I have saved your information so that I can use it to move forward. Thanks again.
 Quoting: Truthserum




You're welcome! Anything to keep anyone from what I went through. Not worth it. Also, google the "Kratom Bible". It tells you a lot about Kratom.
Truthserum

User ID: 69911686
United States
02/08/2018 04:02 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
...


Howdy Neighbor, have you tried it? I've got to find something for "old man" aches and pains. I've been doing NSAID's for years but I seriously think they are causing damage...looking for any alternative to at least try.
 Quoting: Truthserum


I take Kratom every day. I started off by researching each strain. There are many and they can be mixed. If you're looking for pain relief, I would suggest a red strain. I've ordered from a few places but the best and purest strains I have ever gotten are from P A Botanicals. And they have always have it at my door within 3 to 4 days using regular shipping. I just placed an order for Enhanced Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1 and Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1. I get the enhanced because it it contains 10% extract. It takes 50 kilos to make 1 kilo of extract. Sara has her email listed on their web page if you should have questions. I've spoken to her a few times. She can't tell you how much to take because it violates the FDA rules. I bought a scale that measures in grams (100g by 0.01g) from Amazon and started at 1 gram and worked up to obtain the best relief. Depending on my pain, I take between 2.5 to 3.5 grams either once or twice a day. I haven't been on pain meds for nearly 3 years and I no longer feel like a slave to it. I got caught up into the game and was on opiates for nearly a decade. I wish I had found Kratom first. And when I did learn about it, it took me a couple of years to get serious about it. I wish I had not waited so long. I freed myself from prescription Oxycodone, OxyContin, and Hydrocodone. Plus, it gives more energy and a feeling of well being. I've never experienced anything negative with Kratom. You want get high or experience euphoria but you will feel the pain to go away. I've been stocking up since the FDA started their crap again. I'm looking for some Kratom plants to grow. Hope this helps. Best of luck.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75313639


Wow..thanks for that lengthy and in-depth help. I have saved your information so that I can use it to move forward. Thanks again.
 Quoting: Truthserum




You're welcome! Anything to keep anyone from what I went through. Not worth it. Also, google the "Kratom Bible". It tells you a lot about Kratom.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75313639


I'm actually over at the website you mentioned...their prices seem really reasonable from what I was seeing earlier on others...thanks again...
FACTS Don't Give a DAMN about your FEELINGS!
Debauchery

User ID: 75531416
United States
02/08/2018 04:04 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
I've never used it but that is ridiculous.

It's been illegal in my state for a while.
And the LORD spake, saying, "First shalt thou take out the Holy Pin, then shalt thou count to three, no more, no less. Three shall be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be three. Four shalt thou not count, neither count thou two, excepting that thou then proceed to three. Five is right out. Once the number three, being the third number, be reached, then lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who being naughty in My sight, shall snuff it.

I am an evil giraffe, and I shall eat more leaves from this tree than perhaps I should, so that other giraffes may die.
Paranoiaaaaa
Butters

User ID: 76127883
United States
02/08/2018 04:06 PM

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Re: Kratom News...
...


Howdy Neighbor, have you tried it? I've got to find something for "old man" aches and pains. I've been doing NSAID's for years but I seriously think they are causing damage...looking for any alternative to at least try.
 Quoting: Truthserum


I take Kratom every day. I started off by researching each strain. There are many and they can be mixed. If you're looking for pain relief, I would suggest a red strain. I've ordered from a few places but the best and purest strains I have ever gotten are from P A Botanicals. And they have always have it at my door within 3 to 4 days using regular shipping. I just placed an order for Enhanced Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1 and Red Maeng Da Kratom Powder × 1. I get the enhanced because it it contains 10% extract. It takes 50 kilos to make 1 kilo of extract. Sara has her email listed on their web page if you should have questions. I've spoken to her a few times. She can't tell you how much to take because it violates the FDA rules. I bought a scale that measures in grams (100g by 0.01g) from Amazon and started at 1 gram and worked up to obtain the best relief. Depending on my pain, I take between 2.5 to 3.5 grams either once or twice a day. I haven't been on pain meds for nearly 3 years and I no longer feel like a slave to it. I got caught up into the game and was on opiates for nearly a decade. I wish I had found Kratom first. And when I did learn about it, it took me a couple of years to get serious about it. I wish I had not waited so long. I freed myself from prescription Oxycodone, OxyContin, and Hydrocodone. Plus, it gives more energy and a feeling of well being. I've never experienced anything negative with Kratom. You want get high or experience euphoria but you will feel the pain to go away. I've been stocking up since the FDA started their crap again. I'm looking for some Kratom plants to grow. Hope this helps. Best of luck.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75313639


He loves the Top Shelf Bali strain( green). He also takes Bali Red and Sumatra Red. He takes about 2 gr per day. I've heard that rotating strains reduces tolerance so you don't have to keep increasing doses. So he's trying that approach.
 Quoting: Paranoiaaaaa


Does the green helps his pain? I haven't tried gren for pain since the red strains help a lot. I tried the Bali Red and it helped but not has much as the Red Maeng Da. I haven't tried the Red Sumatra either. I do have some green and white in 1 oz sample packs that I never tried. From what I gather, those strains are for mood and ADHD. I may just try them to see how well it does. And I agree on mixing up the strains. I have 3 strains that I go between. Your husband sounds like he didn't want to go around the ringer. Mine injury was from the military plus I have DDD in my spine. I've done all the shots and therapy and for some stupid reason they continue to believe it will help. It's just an excuse because they're now scared shitless to write a prescription. Most will not even write a prescription for it unless your on insurance. They don't like cash payments when it comes to opiate prescriptions. Thankfully, the VA did all mine. It really is a PITA to stay in that game. I'm so glad I'm out of that game. It became pure hell. As they tightened down, it was get harder to get and even getting a prescription filled. It's not like they didn't know that I had rods and screws down my back. It's just stupid and this is why the FDA needs to BTFO from those who want to do the right thing for themselves.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75313639

He says, yes the green Bali helps with the pain, also. He's only tried those 3 strains so far. I bought the red strains because I read they are the best for pain. He said the red strains are more mellow than the green.

He's been seeing the same neurologist for 20 years now. he just can't prescribe hydrocodone anymore. One time, he couldn't get into see his regular guy so he went to the guy filling in for him.

He was a complete DICK! My husband felt because he (my husband) was fairly young and had tattoos, the guy didn't like him the moment he walked in. He said immediately that he "didn't give out drugs here". My husband waited for hours just to get in to see this asshole! the guy only had to look at his records, MRIs and such to see that actually had a medical condition....
"Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you." - Fox Mulder - The X-Files

"Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans." - John Lennon
Anonymous Coward
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02/08/2018 04:13 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
The War on Drugs was a catastrophic failure.
No one is simply going to lie down and let the government walk all over us anymore.
Enough false propaganda.
Enough lies and deceptions.
Enough protection of corrupt business practices and industries.
Now is the time for the Truth, and the Truth shall be revealed.
Anonymous Coward
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02/08/2018 04:26 PM
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Re: Kratom News...
Serious question, other than "getting high", does Kratom have any medicinal purposes?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 35676288


It may have. But a majority of the people using it justify its abuse by saying so.

If you are taking anything "to just get high" then you are abusing the substance......Not what it was intended for.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 74989850


How about you two dolts read all the research and where it's most popular, why they use it.. instead of showing the world your idiocy in this discussion





GLP