Godlike Productions - Discussion Forum
Users Online Now: 2,112 (Who's On?)Visitors Today: 1,040,905
Pageviews Today: 1,870,745Threads Today: 815Posts Today: 14,350
09:10 PM


Rate this Thread

Absolute BS Crap Reasonable Nice Amazing
 

Christians do not go to heaven when they die.

 
Photina  (OP)

User ID: 75760145
Canada
08/07/2018 11:31 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Luke 23:39-43 New International Version (NIV)
39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”

40 But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”

42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]”

43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
 Quoting: Ida Man


Well, Jesus must have been lying to the thief because Jesus did not ascend to Heaven until many weeks later.

Or that translation is wrong.

Choose one.
 Quoting: Photina

Ever hear of the Bosom of Abraham? That is where both Christ and the thief went after death.
 Quoting: Confederate


I thought Jesus went to hades?

Acts 2:29–31
29 “Brothers, I may say to you with confidence about tthe patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and whis tomb is with us to this day. 30 Being therefore a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him that he would set one of his descendants on his throne, 31 he foresaw and spoke about the resurrection of the Christ, that he was not abandoned to Hades, nor did his flesh see corruption.

Last Edited by Photina on 08/07/2018 11:35 PM
Many years you bore with them and warned them by your Spirit through your prophets. Yet they would not give ear. Therefore you gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. You gave your good Spirit to instruct them and did not withhold your manna from their mouth and gave them water for their thirst. Nevertheless, they were disobedient and rebelled against you and cast your law behind their back and killed your prophets, who had warned them in order to turn them back to you, and they committed great blasphemies.
Nehemiah 9:30,20,26, ESV
Ozric

User ID: 76792171
United States
08/07/2018 11:36 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Luke 23:39-43 New International Version (NIV)
39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”

40 But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”

42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]”

43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
 Quoting: Ida Man


Well, Jesus must have been lying to the thief because Jesus did not ascend to Heaven until many weeks later.

Or that translation is wrong.

Choose one.
 Quoting: Photina

Ever hear of the Bosom of Abraham? That is where both Christ and the thief went after death.
 Quoting: Confederate


I can see how that is a possibility, I also am open that its a place called Paradise that we dont know about, or it does relate to heaven at a later time (for the criminal) and when Christ says Today... he means the man is saved today... and at which time he is still subject to all the mechanisms of death that we each face and it simply means he accepted Christ that day = today...

also there is the day is a thousand to the Lord thing as well... so really I have not gone down a commitment road here , other than to say Jesus meant what he said and I believe him, but I might have a misunderstanding as to mechanisms behind it. Or the place that houses Paradise...

Last Edited by Ozric on 08/07/2018 11:43 PM
I do exist, I'm pretty sure :)
Photina  (OP)

User ID: 75760145
Canada
08/08/2018 01:30 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Job 14:12
So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep.

Job 30:20
For I know that you will bring me to death, To the house appointed for all living.

Last Edited by Photina on 08/08/2018 01:59 AM
Many years you bore with them and warned them by your Spirit through your prophets. Yet they would not give ear. Therefore you gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. You gave your good Spirit to instruct them and did not withhold your manna from their mouth and gave them water for their thirst. Nevertheless, they were disobedient and rebelled against you and cast your law behind their back and killed your prophets, who had warned them in order to turn them back to you, and they committed great blasphemies.
Nehemiah 9:30,20,26, ESV
Two-Sixteen

User ID: 76803972
United States
08/08/2018 02:03 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Luke 23:39-43 New International Version (NIV)
39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”

40 But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”

42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]”

43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
 Quoting: Ida Man


Well, Jesus must have been lying to the thief because Jesus did not ascend to Heaven until many weeks later.

Or that translation is wrong.

Choose one.
 Quoting: Photina


Now you're going against the gospel. Jesus did die, but his spirit returned to his body. And what about all of the people with the testimony of being taken to heaven before staying dead/dying? are you saying enoch and elijah were taken by god only to be left under an altar? revelation isn't as easy to understand as all literal meanings
Two-Sixteen

User ID: 76803972
United States
08/08/2018 02:05 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
heaven is my home. i never left, it's just that i live on the earth, and i dont even have to die, so where would I go? i've got a mansion and i like it
Photina  (OP)

User ID: 75760145
Canada
08/08/2018 02:16 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Luke 23:39-43 New International Version (NIV)
39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”

40 But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”

42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]”

43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
 Quoting: Ida Man


Well, Jesus must have been lying to the thief because Jesus did not ascend to Heaven until many weeks later.

Or that translation is wrong.

Choose one.
 Quoting: Photina


Now you're going against the gospel. Jesus did die, but his spirit returned to his body. And what about all of the people with the testimony of being taken to heaven before staying dead/dying? are you saying enoch and elijah were taken by god only to be left under an altar? revelation isn't as easy to understand as all literal meanings
 Quoting: Two-Sixteen


One error at a time.
Many years you bore with them and warned them by your Spirit through your prophets. Yet they would not give ear. Therefore you gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. You gave your good Spirit to instruct them and did not withhold your manna from their mouth and gave them water for their thirst. Nevertheless, they were disobedient and rebelled against you and cast your law behind their back and killed your prophets, who had warned them in order to turn them back to you, and they committed great blasphemies.
Nehemiah 9:30,20,26, ESV
Photina  (OP)

User ID: 75760145
Canada
08/08/2018 02:19 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Elijah and Enoch never died. The fact that they were taken to heaven does not contradict anything I have posted. I said Christians don't go to heaven when they die. Dead Christians can't go to heaven because they don't exist anymore until they are resurrected, then taken to heaven.

That's called a straw man BTW..

Last Edited by Photina on 08/08/2018 02:22 AM
Many years you bore with them and warned them by your Spirit through your prophets. Yet they would not give ear. Therefore you gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. You gave your good Spirit to instruct them and did not withhold your manna from their mouth and gave them water for their thirst. Nevertheless, they were disobedient and rebelled against you and cast your law behind their back and killed your prophets, who had warned them in order to turn them back to you, and they committed great blasphemies.
Nehemiah 9:30,20,26, ESV
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 76821955
Italy
08/08/2018 02:58 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
 Quoting: infinitymindbox


The Bible tells us the soul returns to God at death. But God 'remembers' those that are saved and are given eternal life at the second coming. Until then, we are sleeping.

Good thread OP, its about time Christians learned what the Bible tells us about death. Many seem to not understand this. I dont know why as the Bible is clear about it. Maybe too much TV and not enough reading the scriptures.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 76821955
Italy
08/08/2018 03:01 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Elijah and Enoch never died. The fact that they were taken to heaven does not contradict anything I have posted. I said Christians don't go to heaven when they die. Dead Christians can't go to heaven because they don't exist anymore until they are resurrected, then taken to heaven.

That's called a straw man BTW..
 Quoting: Photina


I agree. How can we go to heaven before being judged at the return of Christ? Thats why it is called judgement day.

Catholic doctrine has muddied these waters.
Photina  (OP)

User ID: 75760145
Canada
08/08/2018 03:57 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Elijah and Enoch never died. The fact that they were taken to heaven does not contradict anything I have posted. I said Christians don't go to heaven when they die. Dead Christians can't go to heaven because they don't exist anymore until they are resurrected, then taken to heaven.

That's called a straw man BTW..
 Quoting: Photina


I agree. How can we go to heaven before being judged at the return of Christ? Thats why it is called judgement day.

Catholic doctrine has muddied these waters.
 Quoting: Brancolino X


Ezekiel 34:19
Must my flock feed on what you have trampled and drink what you have muddied with your feet?
Many years you bore with them and warned them by your Spirit through your prophets. Yet they would not give ear. Therefore you gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. You gave your good Spirit to instruct them and did not withhold your manna from their mouth and gave them water for their thirst. Nevertheless, they were disobedient and rebelled against you and cast your law behind their back and killed your prophets, who had warned them in order to turn them back to you, and they committed great blasphemies.
Nehemiah 9:30,20,26, ESV
Ozric

User ID: 76792171
United States
08/08/2018 11:52 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Matthew 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
 Quoting: infinitymindbox


The Bible tells us the soul returns to God at death. But God 'remembers' those that are saved and are given eternal life at the second coming. Until then, we are sleeping.

Good thread OP, its about time Christians learned what the Bible tells us about death. Many seem to not understand this. I dont know why as the Bible is clear about it. Maybe too much TV and not enough reading the scriptures.
 Quoting: Brancolino X


Yes, this is what the Bible says... however how this is actually accomplished is still a mystery, but this is the best way for our limited minds to comprehend it to any degree.

People have just adopted these other strange theories because it feels good to think your loved one is sitting on a cloud looking down at you smiling...

and dont even get me started on the fundraising scheme nonsense that is purgatory...

Last Edited by Ozric on 08/08/2018 12:00 PM
I do exist, I'm pretty sure :)
TheLordsServant

User ID: 76824385
United States
08/08/2018 01:31 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Luke 23:39-43 New International Version (NIV)
39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”

40 But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”

42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[a]”

43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
 Quoting: Ida Man


Well, Jesus must have been lying to the thief because Jesus did not ascend to Heaven until many weeks later.

Or that translation is wrong.

Choose one.
 Quoting: Photina

Ever hear of the Bosom of Abraham? That is where both Christ and the thief went after death.
 Quoting: Confederate


I can see how that is a possibility, I also am open that its a place called Paradise that we dont know about, or it does relate to heaven at a later time (for the criminal) and when Christ says Today... he means the man is saved today... and at which time he is still subject to all the mechanisms of death that we each face and it simply means he accepted Christ that day = today...

also there is the day is a thousand to the Lord thing as well... so really I have not gone down a commitment road here , other than to say Jesus meant what he said and I believe him, but I might have a misunderstanding as to mechanisms behind it. Or the place that houses Paradise...
 Quoting: Ozric


I lean towards Paradise being a place that isn't really known about. There's no reason for Jesus to make the statement about it if it doesn't exist.

The Transfiguration stands out for me. Moses had died naturally (or by God's Will depending on how you look at it) and Elijah had been taken up by the Father's Will.

Moses couldn't have been resurrected, as Revelation states that Jesus is the "firstborn of the dead". This also rules out any of the other "stories" in the Bible concerning people being brought "back to life" (like Lazarus or the Elijah incident) as being full / true "resurrections". They weren't given "new bodies" like Jesus was, a combination of spirit and His previous "human" body.

The only ones who could qualify for that are the saints that were resurrected just after Jesus' death.
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Boes

User ID: 76344717
Netherlands
08/08/2018 01:42 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
god
Boes
Photina  (OP)

User ID: 75760145
Canada
08/08/2018 05:11 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
And THE LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. Genesis 2:7

The Spirit of God hath made me, and the breath of the Almighty hath given me life. If thou canst answer me, set thy words in order before me, stand up. Behold, I am according to thy wish in God’s stead: I also am formed out of the clay. Job 33:4-6

Thou (God) hidest thy face, they (the beasts) are troubled: thou takest away their breath, they die, and return to their dust.Thou sendest forth thy spirit, they are created: and thou renewest the face of the earth. Psalm 104:29-30

But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die (Hebrew = “dying thou shalt die”). Genesis 2:17

Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned. Romans 5:12

All flesh shall perish together, and man shall turn again unto dust. Job 34:15

I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts. For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again. Ecclesiastes 3:19-21

Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it. Ecclesiastes 12:7
 Quoting: Photina


Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away. James 4:14

Man is like to vanity: his days are as a shadow that passeth away. Psalm 144:4
Many years you bore with them and warned them by your Spirit through your prophets. Yet they would not give ear. Therefore you gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. You gave your good Spirit to instruct them and did not withhold your manna from their mouth and gave them water for their thirst. Nevertheless, they were disobedient and rebelled against you and cast your law behind their back and killed your prophets, who had warned them in order to turn them back to you, and they committed great blasphemies.
Nehemiah 9:30,20,26, ESV
Photina  (OP)

User ID: 76511900
Canada
08/26/2018 06:15 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Bump ! ! !
Many years you bore with them and warned them by your Spirit through your prophets. Yet they would not give ear. Therefore you gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. You gave your good Spirit to instruct them and did not withhold your manna from their mouth and gave them water for their thirst. Nevertheless, they were disobedient and rebelled against you and cast your law behind their back and killed your prophets, who had warned them in order to turn them back to you, and they committed great blasphemies.
Nehemiah 9:30,20,26, ESV
GrandMaster_B

User ID: 69361884
United States
08/26/2018 06:35 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Then who were the spirits Jesus went and preached to that were in prison, that died during the flood. Your doctrines has holes and is a bunch of made up interpretations.
When the log rolls over we are all going to die
Photina  (OP)

User ID: 76511900
Canada
08/26/2018 06:41 PM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Christians do not go to heaven when they die.
Then who were the spirits Jesus went and preached to that were in prison, that died during the flood. Your doctrines has holes and is a bunch of made up interpretations.
 Quoting: GrandMaster_B


What are you even talking about?

Jesus did not continue to live in spirit form when he died, he was dead.

Psalm 115:17
It is not the dead who praise the LORD, those who go down to the place of silence

Ps. 88;10-12
Are your wonderful deeds of any use to the dead? Do their spirits rise up and praise you?

11Shall thy lovingkindness be declared in the grave? or thy faithfulness in destruction?
12Shall thy wonders be known in the dark? and thy righteousness in the land of forgetfulness?

Last Edited by Photina on 08/26/2018 06:45 PM
Many years you bore with them and warned them by your Spirit through your prophets. Yet they would not give ear. Therefore you gave them into the hand of the peoples of the lands. You gave your good Spirit to instruct them and did not withhold your manna from their mouth and gave them water for their thirst. Nevertheless, they were disobedient and rebelled against you and cast your law behind their back and killed your prophets, who had warned them in order to turn them back to you, and they committed great blasphemies.
Nehemiah 9:30,20,26, ESV





GLP