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"Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka

 
WGON
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"Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
"Before the Law"
(excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, less than 50%)
by Franz Kafka

Translation by Ian Johnston

Before the law sits a gatekeeper. To this gatekeeper comes a man from the country who asks to gain entry into the law. But the gatekeeper says that he cannot grant him entry at the moment. The man thinks about it and then asks if he will be allowed to come in later on. “It is possible,” says the gatekeeper, “but not now.” At the moment the gate to the law stands open, as always, and the gatekeeper walks to the side, so the man bends over in order to see through the gate into the inside. When the gatekeeper notices that, he laughs and says: “If it tempts you so much, try it in spite of my prohibition. But take note: I am powerful. And I am only the most lowly gatekeeper. But from room to room stand gatekeepers, each more powerful than the other. I can’t endure even one glimpse of the third.”

The man from the country has not expected such difficulties: the law should always be accessible for everyone, he thinks, but as he now looks more closely at the gatekeeper in his fur coat, at his large pointed nose and his long, thin, black Tartar’s beard, he decides that it would be better to wait until he gets permission to go inside. The gatekeeper gives him a stool and allows him to sit down at the side in front of the gate. There he sits for days and years. He makes many attempts to be let in, and he wears the gatekeeper out with his requests.

The gatekeeper often interrogates him briefly, questioning him about his homeland and many other things, but they are indifferent questions, the kind great men put, and at the end he always tells him once more that he cannot let him inside yet. The man, who has equipped himself with many things for his journey, spends everything, no matter how valuable, to win over the gatekeeper. The latter takes it all but, as he does so, says, “I am taking this only so that you do not think you have failed to do anything.”

During the many years the man observes the gatekeeper almost continuously. He forgets the other gatekeepers, and this one seems to him the only obstacle for entry into the law. He curses the unlucky circumstance, in the first years thoughtlessly and out loud, later, as he grows old, he still mumbles to himself. He becomes childish and, since in the long years studying the gatekeeper he has come to know the fleas in his fur collar, he even asks the fleas to help him persuade the gatekeeper. Finally his eyesight grows weak, and he does not know whether things are really darker around him or whether his eyes are merely deceiving him. But he recognizes now in the darkness an illumination which breaks inextinguishably out of the gateway to the law.

Now he no longer has much time to live. Before his death he gathers in his head all his experiences of the entire time up into one question which he has not yet put to the gatekeeper. He waves to him, since he can no longer lift up his stiffening body.

The gatekeeper has to bend way down to him, for the great difference has changed things to the disadvantage of the man. “What do you still want to know, then?” asks the gatekeeper. “You are insatiable.” “Everyone strives after the law,” says the man, “so how is that in these many years no one except me has requested entry?” The gatekeeper sees that the man is already dying and, in order to reach his diminishing sense of hearing, he shouts at him, “Here no one else can gain entry, since this entrance was assigned only to you. I’m going now to close it.

[link to www.kafka-online.info]
 Quoting: kafka-online


pelosischumer3 impeach1

Last Edited by WGON on 12/02/2019 12:50 PM
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

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WGON  (OP)
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
bump
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
WGON  (OP)
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Hawaiian Democrat Senator Mazie Keiko Hirono's "Court of Credibility" logically demands that:

"YOU ARE GUILTY. Prove you're not. And even if you do... we don't care."
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
WGON  (OP)
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Hawaiian Democrat Senator Mazie Keiko Hirono's "Court of Credibility" logically demands that:

"YOU ARE GUILTY. Prove you're not. And even if you do... we don't care. Kavanaugh, and ALL men need to shut up and take it in the ass"
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
lythandewilder

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09/25/2018 03:17 AM
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
So... these frightened people approached me, but I didn't know some of the stuff they asked about, and reassured them of others, but said I would try to find out, because their concerns were pure.
In the darkness the largest timber and iron strap and stud door I had ever encountered, opened soundlessly.
I entered.
They appeared to not be waiting for me, and so I stated my friends concerns, then left.
The light time in the dark and another door opened, as fragile as ice, winking and controlled.
I kept on walking.

I found this story interesting.

Thank you.
WGON  (OP)
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
bump
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
Anonymous Coward
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10/05/2018 11:40 PM
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Hawaiian Democrat Senator Mazie Keiko Hirono's "Court of Credibility" logically demands that:

"YOU ARE GUILTY. Prove you're not. And even if you do... we don't care."
 Quoting: WGON


And if you need surgery or you are going to die, they will cancel your insurance out of pure vicious spite. Because they are powerful and can do so.
WGON  (OP)
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Thread: When will Humanity read lawlessness as Law?
Archaic Smile
Offer Upgrade
User ID: 77658685
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06/17/2019 04:13 PM

When will you read stories, articles, talk around town that Lawlessness is either Law or abides within the constraints of Law?

How often do we already see Lawlessness being either ignored, not reported, not properly prosecuted within our local, regional levels?

__

When is the Limit? What draws the line?

What about the Future inhabitants....
 Quoting: Archaic Smile

Kinda already there Jimmy. The spirit of the legal process is dead.
 Quoting: anonymous coward 76076258

WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
WGON  (OP)
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Thread: 17,000 pages of Law
Builder of the Adytum
User ID: 77095110
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10/18/2019 06:27 PM

How can a society that has a legal code 17,000 pages long reasonably expect the average citizen to be able to conform to the law?


Such a legal code makes criminals of us all. It makes people lose all respect for "law", when only a handful of experts even understand one small part of the legal field.


My sister is a labor lawyer. She would be completely out of her depths in a criminal courtroom, of course.

My mother, a criminal lawyer and former judge would be equally lost looking at a business contract.



17,000 pages of law and have we become more law-abiding as that legal code has grown or LESS LAW -ABIDING?


Since 1900, the homicide rate in America has grown steadily, for instance from 1.2 per 100,000 to about 5 per 100,000 today.

[link to en.wikipedia.org (secure)]

Meanwhile...

Quote:

Number and growth of criminal laws

There are conflicting opinions on the number of federal crimes,[78][79] but many have argued that there has been explosive growth and it has become overwhelming.[80][81][82] In 1982, the U.S. Justice Department could not come up with a number, but estimated 3,000 crimes in the United States Code.[78][79][83] In 1998, the American Bar Association (ABA) said that it was likely much higher than 3,000, but didn't give a specific estimate.[78][79] In 2008, the Heritage Foundation published a report that put the number at a minimum of 4,450.[79] When staff for a task force of the U.S. House Judiciary Committee asked the Congressional Research Service (CRS) to update its 2008 calculation of criminal offenses in the United States Code in 2013, the CRS responded that they lack the manpower and resources to accomplish the task.[84]


[link to en.wikipedia.org (secure)]

SMH
 Quoting: Builder of the Adytum

WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
WGON  (OP)
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12/02/2019 12:11 PM

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
bump
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
WGON  (OP)
"Get that idiot off the air!"

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12/02/2019 12:45 PM

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
bump

Last Edited by WGON on 12/02/2019 12:47 PM
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
Anonymous Coward
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12/02/2019 12:47 PM
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Bump for Kafkaesque doom, one of my favorite flavors.
LTHN.
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12/02/2019 01:04 PM
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
"Before the Law"
(excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, less than 50%)
by Franz Kafka

Translation by Ian Johnston

Before the law sits a gatekeeper. To this gatekeeper comes a man from the country who asks to gain entry into the law. But the gatekeeper says that he cannot grant him entry at the moment. The man thinks about it and then asks if he will be allowed to come in later on. “It is possible,” says the gatekeeper, “but not now.” At the moment the gate to the law stands open, as always, and the gatekeeper walks to the side, so the man bends over in order to see through the gate into the inside. When the gatekeeper notices that, he laughs and says: “If it tempts you so much, try it in spite of my prohibition. But take note: I am powerful. And I am only the most lowly gatekeeper. But from room to room stand gatekeepers, each more powerful than the other. I can’t endure even one glimpse of the third.”

The man from the country has not expected such difficulties: the law should always be accessible for everyone, he thinks, but as he now looks more closely at the gatekeeper in his fur coat, at his large pointed nose and his long, thin, black Tartar’s beard, he decides that it would be better to wait until he gets permission to go inside. The gatekeeper gives him a stool and allows him to sit down at the side in front of the gate. There he sits for days and years. He makes many attempts to be let in, and he wears the gatekeeper out with his requests.

The gatekeeper often interrogates him briefly, questioning him about his homeland and many other things, but they are indifferent questions, the kind great men put, and at the end he always tells him once more that he cannot let him inside yet. The man, who has equipped himself with many things for his journey, spends everything, no matter how valuable, to win over the gatekeeper. The latter takes it all but, as he does so, says, “I am taking this only so that you do not think you have failed to do anything.”

During the many years the man observes the gatekeeper almost continuously. He forgets the other gatekeepers, and this one seems to him the only obstacle for entry into the law. He curses the unlucky circumstance, in the first years thoughtlessly and out loud, later, as he grows old, he still mumbles to himself. He becomes childish and, since in the long years studying the gatekeeper he has come to know the fleas in his fur collar, he even asks the fleas to help him persuade the gatekeeper. Finally his eyesight grows weak, and he does not know whether things are really darker around him or whether his eyes are merely deceiving him. But he recognizes now in the darkness an illumination which breaks inextinguishably out of the gateway to the law.

Now he no longer has much time to live. Before his death he gathers in his head all his experiences of the entire time up into one question which he has not yet put to the gatekeeper. He waves to him, since he can no longer lift up his stiffening body.

The gatekeeper has to bend way down to him, for the great difference has changed things to the disadvantage of the man. “What do you still want to know, then?” asks the gatekeeper. “You are insatiable.” “Everyone strives after the law,” says the man, “so how is that in these many years no one except me has requested entry?” The gatekeeper sees that the man is already dying and, in order to reach his diminishing sense of hearing, he shouts at him, “Here no one else can gain entry, since this entrance was assigned only to you. I’m going now to close it.

[link to www.kafka-online.info]
 Quoting: kafka-online


:pelosischumer3: :impeach1:
 Quoting: WGON


Always love that part of the book, so much to philosophically approach that part.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
This sums it up for me.

His work, which fuses elements of realism and the fantastic,[4] typically features isolated protagonists facing bizarre or surrealistic predicaments and incomprehensible socio-bureaucratic powers, and has been interpreted as exploring themes of alienation, existential anxiety, guilt, and absurdity.[5]
WGON  (OP)
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
This sums it up for me.

His work, which fuses elements of realism and the fantastic,[4] typically features isolated protagonists facing bizarre or surrealistic predicaments and incomprehensible socio-bureaucratic powers, and has been interpreted as exploring themes of alienation, existential anxiety, guilt, and absurdity.[5]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78218344


In addition to Kafka, I also like the paintings of George Tooker. Very... dismal.

TookerGvtBureau

George Tooker, "Government Bureau'. 1956
The Metropolitan Museum of Art and DC Moore Gallery, NY

*Fair use for educational purposes applies.

Last Edited by WGON on 12/02/2019 01:31 PM
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
Anonymous Coward
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12/02/2019 02:02 PM
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Speaking of Kafka if you want to see an outstanding conspiracy movie here it is.

Anonymous Coward
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12/02/2019 02:13 PM
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
wow - thanks OP.
Lots of meaning and truth there.

There are the 'keepers of the law' who don't give a crap about you and who themselves are above the law.
WGON  (OP)
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
wow - thanks OP.
Lots of meaning and truth there.

There are the 'keepers of the law' who don't give a crap about you and who themselves are above the law.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72530568


dale-thumbs
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
WGON  (OP)
"Get that idiot off the air!"

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12/02/2019 03:32 PM

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Speaking of Kafka if you want to see an outstanding conspiracy movie here it is.


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78069867


Ah... Jeremy Irons. Must watch it later tonight!

Thanks!
WGON - "Your Eye In The Sky"

Through readiness and discipline, we are masters of our fate.
You might call that notion ironic.
But trust me, you'll come around.

Thread: We Are Literally Witnessing The First Stages Of The Global Zombie Apocalypse

"Meet me on the roof
at 9 o'clock. We're getting out.
We've got to survive.
Somebody's got to survive!"

WWG1WGA!
Anonymous Coward
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12/02/2019 03:49 PM
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Tartar reference is term like musselman or mohamedden. They were a group that "converted" to islime.
SWOOPSTER

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12/02/2019 04:24 PM

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Great thread WGON..
~SWOOP~
Loup Garou

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12/02/2019 04:43 PM

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Hawaiian Democrat Senator Mazie Keiko Hirono's "Court of Credibility" logically demands that:

"YOU ARE GUILTY. Prove you're not. And even if you do... we don't care."
 Quoting: WGON


Hawaii Sen. Mazie Hirono, a Democrat from Hawaii …

Is she acting as a foreign agent? *She was born 6 years after the attack on Pearl Harbor by the Imperial Japanese Navy Air Service…..

Her name is a Japanese name Hirono Keiko; she was born November 3, 1947) and is a Japanese-born American politician, or was she born in Japan?

Hawaii Sen. Mazie Hirono, a Democrat from Hawaii, I have a few questions, like…

What did Sen. Mazie Hirono, a Democrat from Hawaii do to earn a living between her defeat when running for Governor in 2002 until 2007 when she was elected to the House of Representatives?

The years 2002 when Obama first came on the scene and his past was created and fine tuned including a forged birth certificate?

Questions, always questions....

She is actually practicing and Exploiting LAWFARE, which is a form of war consisting of the use of the legal system against an enemy, such as by damaging or delegitimizing them, tying up their time or winning a public relations victory.
Just because YOU don’t believe
in the Rougarou; or the Loup Garou, don’t make you safe; No !

The Constitution is a blend of 'moral certitude' -- which is one of the reasons that criminals are determined to be rid of it and We the People must be even more determined to defend it.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." - Thomas Paine

The only thing the Illuminati fears is an independent person who can live, eat, sleep, stay warm and defend themselves separate from Federal help. Pray that the Lord gives us more time! The End is near and time is short!

A fool takes no pleasure in understanding, but only in expressing his opinion. ~Proverbs 18:2


For those who understand, no explanation is needed. For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible

"A candle loses nothing by lighting another candle" - James Keller

Checkd, Keked, and Rekt!
Grove Street

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
great book. read it ages ago. worthbump
a reread
Grove

And this is why we can't have nice things.
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
That is the law, a big bluff.


The gatekeeper was lying, as most people who make their living in law do.

The man could have entered at any time, but the gatekeeper intimidated him with tales of terror.




Sadly now, the lying has become so pervasive that even those with the fortitude to enter it will encounter lies at the highest level.

Humankind has lost its integrity, what little bit was garnered from the hope of the republics. The animals are taking over.

I pray the chastisement comes soon.
Scorpionica

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
Bump for Kafkaesque doom, one of my favorite flavors.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76155484


TRHPS-mindfk
"An unfailing experience of mundane events in harmony with the changes occurring in the heavens has instructed and compelled my unwilling belief." Johannes Kepler

"And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years..." Genesis 1:14
XeroGravity
ytivarGeroX

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
WGON: I just read your Kafka excerpt. I'm a pretty well-read guy but never any Kafka. As I was reading that, it was like having deja vu. I know I've heard a very similar story before.

There is an alchemical treatise that built on the Rosicrucian Manifestos from the early 1600s ("Chymical Wedding of Christian Rosenkreuz" to be exact). I don't recall the name of it nor the author, but I suspect Kafka is making an almost parable-like retort to that particular treatise. If I weren't headed to bed shortly I'd rummage through my library to find it, but I'm 95% certain that this Kafka piece is exactly that. In the original Alchemical treatise, the seeker at the gate overcomes the gate guards after some years & is enlightened after some travails. Or some such thing - read this stuff years ago & my memory is hazy.

I've seen similar narrative in some obscure Grail romance but can't recall which (too damned many of them, but it's in the vein of Fisher King stories). It irks the shit out of me that I can't remember the titles on this stuff.
There's no such thing as gravity. The Earth just sucks.
Loup Garou

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
WGON: I just read your Kafka excerpt. I'm a pretty well-read guy but never any Kafka. As I was reading that, it was like having deja vu. I know I've heard a very similar story before.

There is an alchemical treatise that built on the Rosicrucian Manifestos from the early 1600s ("Chymical Wedding of Christian Rosenkreuz" to be exact). I don't recall the name of it nor the author, but I suspect Kafka is making an almost parable-like retort to that particular treatise. If I weren't headed to bed shortly I'd rummage through my library to find it, but I'm 95% certain that this Kafka piece is exactly that. In the original Alchemical treatise, the seeker at the gate overcomes the gate guards after some years & is enlightened after some travails. Or some such thing - read this stuff years ago & my memory is hazy.

I've seen similar narrative in some obscure Grail romance but can't recall which (too damned many of them, but it's in the vein of Fisher King stories). It irks the shit out of me that I can't remember the titles on this stuff.
 Quoting: XeroGravity


Thank you for this nugget. Food for thought

Last Edited by Loup Garou on 12/02/2019 05:59 PM
Just because YOU don’t believe
in the Rougarou; or the Loup Garou, don’t make you safe; No !

The Constitution is a blend of 'moral certitude' -- which is one of the reasons that criminals are determined to be rid of it and We the People must be even more determined to defend it.

"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace." - Thomas Paine

The only thing the Illuminati fears is an independent person who can live, eat, sleep, stay warm and defend themselves separate from Federal help. Pray that the Lord gives us more time! The End is near and time is short!

A fool takes no pleasure in understanding, but only in expressing his opinion. ~Proverbs 18:2


For those who understand, no explanation is needed. For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible

"A candle loses nothing by lighting another candle" - James Keller

Checkd, Keked, and Rekt!
LTHN.
Toward the Within.

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12/02/2019 06:00 PM

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
WGON: I just read your Kafka excerpt. I'm a pretty well-read guy but never any Kafka. As I was reading that, it was like having deja vu. I know I've heard a very similar story before.

There is an alchemical treatise that built on the Rosicrucian Manifestos from the early 1600s ("Chymical Wedding of Christian Rosenkreuz" to be exact). I don't recall the name of it nor the author, but I suspect Kafka is making an almost parable-like retort to that particular treatise. If I weren't headed to bed shortly I'd rummage through my library to find it, but I'm 95% certain that this Kafka piece is exactly that. In the original Alchemical treatise, the seeker at the gate overcomes the gate guards after some years & is enlightened after some travails. Or some such thing - read this stuff years ago & my memory is hazy.

I've seen similar narrative in some obscure Grail romance but can't recall which (too damned many of them, but it's in the vein of Fisher King stories). It irks the shit out of me that I can't remember the titles on this stuff.
 Quoting: XeroGravity


There are similarities in the two, for sure.
Keep reading the chapter in 'The Trial' where that excerpt pops up, the analyzing of it's meaning by the two characters is quite informative.

Last Edited by LTHN. on 12/02/2019 06:00 PM
" The map is not the territory..."
XJDUB

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
"YOU ARE GUILTY. Prove you're not. And even if you do... we don't care."
 Quoting: WGON

If you prove THEY'RE guilty with VIDEO (that meets evidence admissibility standards) they'll care. We have to MAKE these people care. Get in their faces!
Let the facts fall wherever, whenever, and however they may.

INTP - The Logician. 'Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is not to stop questioning.' - Albert Einstein.
LTHN.
Toward the Within.

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12/02/2019 06:03 PM

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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
WGON: I just read your Kafka excerpt. I'm a pretty well-read guy but never any Kafka. As I was reading that, it was like having deja vu. I know I've heard a very similar story before.

There is an alchemical treatise that built on the Rosicrucian Manifestos from the early 1600s ("Chymical Wedding of Christian Rosenkreuz" to be exact). I don't recall the name of it nor the author, but I suspect Kafka is making an almost parable-like retort to that particular treatise. If I weren't headed to bed shortly I'd rummage through my library to find it, but I'm 95% certain that this Kafka piece is exactly that. In the original Alchemical treatise, the seeker at the gate overcomes the gate guards after some years & is enlightened after some travails. Or some such thing - read this stuff years ago & my memory is hazy.

I've seen similar narrative in some obscure Grail romance but can't recall which (too damned many of them, but it's in the vein of Fisher King stories). It irks the shit out of me that I can't remember the titles on this stuff.
 Quoting: XeroGravity


Thank you for this nugget. Food for thought
 Quoting: Loup Garou


If interested in reading 'The Chymical Wedding Of Christian Rosenkreuz '

[link to 39514839f4a6dc8a84ae-eaa972a576b84b28f1b3596cd9812f8f.ssl.cf5​.rackcdn.com (secure)]
" The map is not the territory..."
Anonymous Coward
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12/02/2019 06:11 PM
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Re: "Before the Law", excerpt from "The Trial" published in 1925, by Franz Kafka
WGON: I just read your Kafka excerpt. I'm a pretty well-read guy but never any Kafka. As I was reading that, it was like having deja vu. I know I've heard a very similar story before.

There is an alchemical treatise that built on the Rosicrucian Manifestos from the early 1600s ("Chymical Wedding of Christian Rosenkreuz" to be exact). I don't recall the name of it nor the author, but I suspect Kafka is making an almost parable-like retort to that particular treatise. If I weren't headed to bed shortly I'd rummage through my library to find it, but I'm 95% certain that this Kafka piece is exactly that. In the original Alchemical treatise, the seeker at the gate overcomes the gate guards after some years & is enlightened after some travails. Or some such thing - read this stuff years ago & my memory is hazy.

I've seen similar narrative in some obscure Grail romance but can't recall which (too damned many of them, but it's in the vein of Fisher King stories). It irks the shit out of me that I can't remember the titles on this stuff.
 Quoting: XeroGravity


Thank you for this nugget. Food for thought
 Quoting: Loup Garou


If interested in reading 'The Chymical Wedding Of Christian Rosenkreuz '

[link to 39514839f4a6dc8a84ae-eaa972a576b84b28f1b3596cd9812f8f.ssl.cf5​.rackcdn.com (secure)]
 Quoting: LTHN.


Very cool, thanks.





GLP