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Tramadol - the danger and the lies

 
MountainTux NLI
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12/08/2018 01:23 PM

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Tramadol - the danger and the lies
Tramadol, once considered a "safe" alternative to narcotics has proven to be anything but safe... but the doctors still lie about it's addictive and dangerous effects.

--------------------------------------------

"The problem didn’t just emerge in the U.S. Tramadol has become a widely available and widely abused drug across the world, as a recent report in the Wall Street Journal spelled out, pointing out horrible abuse in African nations of Cameroon and Nigeria. Ireland has seen overdoses from Tramadol soar. Egypt has been another victim of the misleading perceptions of the drug, as cheap pills have spread as daily-helpers among the poor and working class.

Finally, in 2014, the DEA finally changed Tramadol to a Schedule IV designation as a controlled substance. But the World Health Organization continues to classify the drug without restriction, under the belief that it would become much more difficult to obtain by people who need legitimate pain relief, according to the Wall Street Journal report.

When you actually consider the real world experience of people taking the drug, however, it quickly becomes evident that Tramadol, like other opioids prescribed for pain relief, also carries the trade off of dependency and withdrawal. Among the 50 or so first-person reports on Iodine.com, many Tramadol users cite these effects.

“I wish I knew this was an addictive narcotic. My doc told me it was non narcotic,” offered one user, who identified herself as a 36 year old woman.

This is exactly what makes Tramadol so dangerous. Despite it’s reputation as being a “safe” opioid, it is still an opioid. These drugs have been massively over-prescribed over the past 20 years, causing an opioid crisis in the U.S. with thousands of people suffering the consequences of addiction, ruined lives, and death. In 2014 alone, more than 28,000 people died from opioid overdose — at least half of them prescription drugs, compared to street drugs like heroin (which are often the cheaper drug of choice among people who started with a prescription opioid)."

[link to blog.iodine.com (secure)]

SNIP--------------------------------------


Oh goodness... I was of the impression that anything prescribed by the doctor was safe and harmless, non-addictive and did not cause any sort of high or dependence?

Sheesh, seems that someone up the chain may have been lying? Hard to believe!

1dunno1
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
TlvmmCpoft

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12/08/2018 01:25 PM
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've had those prescribed multiple times now. Never actually taken one.
I don't know what lies they told you, but I can promise they were lies.

Silencing yourself and living in the dark just means you've left yourself exposed to the type of people who wander the dark looking for victims who won't scream.
KLOWN

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12/08/2018 01:27 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
first time i took that shit i was a mess

was at work that day and was puking like crazy all dizzy and shit

taken it many times since and i did not react like that

doc gave me a couple "trial packs"
Irredeemable
Living in a dream

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12/08/2018 01:30 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
Some nasty shit. I wouldn't think of touching one again. I know how opiates work, I suffered through that addiction for years. Tramadol is different. Tramadol should be taken off the market.


Sure, they will get ya high, but it's not a high you will enjoy. And the dreams... Jesus Christ the dreams they gave me. No thanks.
We are eternal... All this pain is an illusion
MountainTux NLI  (OP)

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12/08/2018 01:35 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
Really? This all seems odd... we have a poster that says they don't GET high from these meds.

Such conflicting information... I'm confused...

rofl

Would appreciate if someone would share this in "another" thread, as someone decided to put the truth on ignore.

Seriously, CKP gives me more fun during my work hours....

lolsign
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
Irredeemable
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12/08/2018 01:39 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
Really? This all seems odd... we have a poster that says they don't GET high from these meds.

Such conflicting information... I'm confused...

rofl

Would appreciate if someone would share this in "another" thread, as someone decided to put the truth on ignore.

Seriously, CKP gives me more fun during my work hours....

lolsign
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


LOL

That homo is so full of shit it's pouring out his ears.

I think he has me on ignore also.

But yes, it most certainly gets you high, and so does the other codeine and morphine he claims doesn't. Been there, done all that. That shit damn near killed me.
We are eternal... All this pain is an illusion
MountainTux NLI  (OP)

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12/08/2018 01:41 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
Really? This all seems odd... we have a poster that says they don't GET high from these meds.

Such conflicting information... I'm confused...

rofl

Would appreciate if someone would share this in "another" thread, as someone decided to put the truth on ignore.

Seriously, CKP gives me more fun during my work hours....

lolsign
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


LOL

That homo is so full of shit it's pouring out his ears.

I think he has me on ignore also.

But yes, it most certainly gets you high, and so does the other codeine and morphine he claims doesn't. Been there, done all that. That shit damn near killed me.
 Quoting: Irredeemable


The one that ABSOLUTELY floors me...
"My docs say if you use it for pain, you won't get high, you only get high if you use it for recreation."

Like... seriously... WTF?

It has a different effect based on your INTENTION? "I WILL NOT GET HIGH, I WILL JUST GET PAIN RELIEF."

Err.. the pain relief is the RESULT of you getting high!

The utter stupidity.... man.

But at least it's entertaining!
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
YellowVest

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12/08/2018 01:41 PM
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
they say it's an opiod pain killer , but also say it's a serotonin uptake inhibitor/ aka prozac.

but so, we don't know what it is huh.

that's nice

here's a pill, we don't know what's in it, take it
NowIhavetothinkofanam​e

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12/08/2018 01:42 PM
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've had those prescribed multiple times now. Never actually taken one.
 Quoting: TlvmmCpoft


:youwontheinternet:

Taking opioids for anything non life threatening is just outright stoopid. So far I've only taken low dose Codeine as part of over the counter medication.

I get why people like opioids, they get high off them but all they do is dull the pain or at least Codeine did.
NowIhavetothinkofanameohnoithurts
It's all bull!
Nevertheless, the ruler is not truly wise who cannot discern evils before they develop themselves, and this is a faculty given to few. Niccolo Machiavelli
Karma is funny, people who kick dogs usually get bitten.
If someone doesn't add value to your life, then that someone shouldn't be a part of it.
You can always trust people to do whatever is in their own interests.
It is certain wastelands will be brought under cultivation.
MountainTux NLI  (OP)

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12/08/2018 01:43 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
they say it's an opiod pain killer , but also say it's a serotonin uptake inhibitor/ aka prozac.

but so, we don't know what it is huh.

that's nice

here's a pill, we don't know what's in it, take it
 Quoting: YellowVest


So yeah, basically every new drug produced and "clinically tested before approval" in the last 30 years or so.

I think I'll stick to something that's been proven over the last couple of thousand, thanks (nod)
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
MountainTux NLI  (OP)

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12/08/2018 01:45 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've had those prescribed multiple times now. Never actually taken one.
 Quoting: TlvmmCpoft


:youwontheinternet:

Taking opioids for anything non life threatening is just outright stoopid. So far I've only taken low dose Codeine as part of over the counter medication.

I get why people like opioids, they get high off them but all they do is dull the pain or at least Codeine did.
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


Agreed, but not having ever used opioids or narcotics, I'm not sure of why people would like the high. I've been TOLD it varies from feeling stupid to feeling dead... the thought creeps me out. No thanks!
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
KLOWN

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12/08/2018 01:47 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
Really? This all seems odd... we have a poster that says they don't GET high from these meds.

Such conflicting information... I'm confused...

rofl

Would appreciate if someone would share this in "another" thread, as someone decided to put the truth on ignore.

Seriously, CKP gives me more fun during my work hours....

lolsign
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


LOL

That homo is so full of shit it's pouring out his ears.

I think he has me on ignore also.

But yes, it most certainly gets you high, and so does the other codeine and morphine he claims doesn't. Been there, done all that. That shit damn near killed me.
 Quoting: Irredeemable


The one that ABSOLUTELY floors me...
"My docs say if you use it for pain, you won't get high, you only get high if you use it for recreation."

Like... seriously... WTF?

It has a different effect based on your INTENTION? "I WILL NOT GET HIGH, I WILL JUST GET PAIN RELIEF."

Err.. the pain relief is the RESULT of you getting high!

The utter stupidity.... man.

But at least it's entertaining!
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


some one said that

WOW lmao
Anonymous Coward
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12/08/2018 01:48 PM
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
Really? This all seems odd... we have a poster that says they don't GET high from these meds.

Such conflicting information... I'm confused...

rofl

Would appreciate if someone would share this in "another" thread, as someone decided to put the truth on ignore.

Seriously, CKP gives me more fun during my work hours....

lolsign
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


I took it for pain after back surgery. No high and it sure as hell didn't work. Shit medicine just like the rest. I've heard some say they became dependent but I can't verify this nor do I care now. I went the natural route after learning my lessons. I couldn't be more happier.
NowIhavetothinkofanam​e

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12/08/2018 01:50 PM
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've had those prescribed multiple times now. Never actually taken one.
 Quoting: TlvmmCpoft


:youwontheinternet:

Taking opioids for anything non life threatening is just outright stoopid. So far I've only taken low dose Codeine as part of over the counter medication.

I get why people like opioids, they get high off them but all they do is dull the pain or at least Codeine did.
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


Agreed, but not having ever used opioids or narcotics, I'm not sure of why people would like the high. I've been TOLD it varies from feeling stupid to feeling dead... the thought creeps me out. No thanks!
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


I've never understood getting high as a coping strategy. I think it's like drinking, where people drink to get drunk because they're depressed.
NowIhavetothinkofanameohnoithurts
It's all bull!
Nevertheless, the ruler is not truly wise who cannot discern evils before they develop themselves, and this is a faculty given to few. Niccolo Machiavelli
Karma is funny, people who kick dogs usually get bitten.
If someone doesn't add value to your life, then that someone shouldn't be a part of it.
You can always trust people to do whatever is in their own interests.
It is certain wastelands will be brought under cultivation.
TlvmmCpoft

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12/08/2018 01:50 PM
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've had those prescribed multiple times now. Never actually taken one.
 Quoting: TlvmmCpoft


:youwontheinternet:

Taking opioids for anything non life threatening is just outright stoopid. So far I've only taken low dose Codeine as part of over the counter medication.

I get why people like opioids, they get high off them but all they do is dull the pain or at least Codeine did.
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


Agreed, but not having ever used opioids or narcotics, I'm not sure of why people would like the high. I've been TOLD it varies from feeling stupid to feeling dead... the thought creeps me out. No thanks!
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


I took Oxycontin when I was being eaten alive by cancer. It was the only thing that dulled the pain, but it also took away those years. I was a complete zombie dragging through, hated how cotton-brained and tired it made me. I barely remember a thing from those years. But at least it was a normal opioid. I have no idea what the hell Tramadol is.
I don't know what lies they told you, but I can promise they were lies.

Silencing yourself and living in the dark just means you've left yourself exposed to the type of people who wander the dark looking for victims who won't scream.
MountainTux NLI  (OP)

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12/08/2018 01:53 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
Really? This all seems odd... we have a poster that says they don't GET high from these meds.

Such conflicting information... I'm confused...

rofl

Would appreciate if someone would share this in "another" thread, as someone decided to put the truth on ignore.

Seriously, CKP gives me more fun during my work hours....

lolsign
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


LOL

That homo is so full of shit it's pouring out his ears.

I think he has me on ignore also.

But yes, it most certainly gets you high, and so does the other codeine and morphine he claims doesn't. Been there, done all that. That shit damn near killed me.
 Quoting: Irredeemable


The one that ABSOLUTELY floors me...
"My docs say if you use it for pain, you won't get high, you only get high if you use it for recreation."

Like... seriously... WTF?

It has a different effect based on your INTENTION? "I WILL NOT GET HIGH, I WILL JUST GET PAIN RELIEF."

Err.. the pain relief is the RESULT of you getting high!

The utter stupidity.... man.

But at least it's entertaining!
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


some one said that

WOW lmao
 Quoting: KLOWN


Yeah, that was what CKP said right before I quoted it as PROOF of his lack of sanity... that's when he got mad and decided to put me on ignore laugh
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
Anonymous Coward
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12/08/2018 01:55 PM
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've had those prescribed multiple times now. Never actually taken one.
 Quoting: TlvmmCpoft


:youwontheinternet:

Taking opioids for anything non life threatening is just outright stoopid. So far I've only taken low dose Codeine as part of over the counter medication.

I get why people like opioids, they get high off them but all they do is dull the pain or at least Codeine did.
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


Agreed, but not having ever used opioids or narcotics, I'm not sure of why people would like the high. I've been TOLD it varies from feeling stupid to feeling dead... the thought creeps me out. No thanks!
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


I took Oxycontin when I was being eaten alive by cancer. It was the only thing that dulled the pain, but it also took away those years. I was a complete zombie dragging through, hated how cotton-brained and tired it made me. I barely remember a thing from those years. But at least it was a normal opioid. I have no idea what the hell Tramadol is.
 Quoting: TlvmmCpoft


Same here. It works well for pain but those years are lost. I can't recall much during the years I was on it. Have memory loss. It was given to me for a back injury and the a fusion. No longer use any it and don't want it.
janedoenut

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've never taken tramadol or any other bs Rx (many years) but I can attest that pain relievers do work differently on pain vs recreation. Sounds nuts but it's true.
“If you'll let me tell you what I imagine about myself, you'll find it a lot more interesting” –Anne Shirley


"Seemingly your father nor mother taught you that as a man, it's your job to protect and provide for women and lead strong families. As men, had you done your job, you wouldn't be living in a matriarchal society." - Janedoenut, 2018
MountainTux NLI  (OP)

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've had those prescribed multiple times now. Never actually taken one.
 Quoting: TlvmmCpoft


:youwontheinternet:

Taking opioids for anything non life threatening is just outright stoopid. So far I've only taken low dose Codeine as part of over the counter medication.

I get why people like opioids, they get high off them but all they do is dull the pain or at least Codeine did.
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


Agreed, but not having ever used opioids or narcotics, I'm not sure of why people would like the high. I've been TOLD it varies from feeling stupid to feeling dead... the thought creeps me out. No thanks!
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


I've never understood getting high as a coping strategy. I think it's like drinking, where people drink to get drunk because they're depressed.
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


I understand, in theory, that people use it to ignore or defer the effects of pain. However, what I DON'T understand is why the SAME people will reject non-pharmaceuticals which not only help to deal with pain, but actually help ti REMEDIATE the issues CAUSING the pain. So, take a narcotic to get you high, or take a cannabinoid that may or may not get you high, but will help not only with the pain, but in many cases with the CAUSE.

But taking narcotics is "sane and intelligent."
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
MountainTux NLI  (OP)

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12/08/2018 01:58 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've never taken tramadol or any other bs Rx (many years) but I can attest that pain relievers do work differently on pain vs recreation. Sounds nuts but it's true.
 Quoting: janedoenut


I understand the theory, certainly - the more pain you are in the less effective the drug, because it needs to be at a level to combat the pain. So you use MORE, to get a similar masking effect.

And I'm not judging from that respect, but the argument that "you don't get high if you use for pain" is patently untrue... if you didn't get "high," the drug wouldn't fulfill it's intended purpose.

For background, this is mostly about refuting someone else's foolishness... plus it's my Friday so I'm having a bit of fun :) Welcome!

Last Edited by MountainTux NLI on 12/08/2018 01:59 PM
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
Cannabis Kills People

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Thread Hidden Thread Hidden 18 201

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wtfdid
Cannabis destroys the heart and vascular system, dangerously lowers blood pressure and causes psychosis and paranoia

Gemma Moss, 31, becomes first woman in Britain to DIE from cannabis poisoning

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Kamchatka
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
I've only taken it once - did NOT notice that it made me high at all, but gave me a creepy headache and general feeling of unease. And it didn't do squat for the pain. Cannot even imaging taking enough to get addicted to, but everyone experiences drugs differently. I'd feel way safer with a genuine opiate which does actually relieve the pain. When you know up front it's addictive, you come in prepared.
More deplorable all the time.
MountainTux NLI  (OP)

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12/08/2018 02:02 PM

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wtfdid
 Quoting: Cannabis Kills People


Err, I'm sorry... how are you here? I'm on ignore... plus I didn't invite you?

Are... are you STALKING me?

hiding
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”
NowIhavetothinkofanam​e

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
...


:youwontheinternet:

Taking opioids for anything non life threatening is just outright stoopid. So far I've only taken low dose Codeine as part of over the counter medication.

I get why people like opioids, they get high off them but all they do is dull the pain or at least Codeine did.
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


Agreed, but not having ever used opioids or narcotics, I'm not sure of why people would like the high. I've been TOLD it varies from feeling stupid to feeling dead... the thought creeps me out. No thanks!
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


I've never understood getting high as a coping strategy. I think it's like drinking, where people drink to get drunk because they're depressed.
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


I understand, in theory, that people use it to ignore or defer the effects of pain. However, what I DON'T understand is why the SAME people will reject non-pharmaceuticals which not only help to deal with pain, but actually help ti REMEDIATE the issues CAUSING the pain. So, take a narcotic to get you high, or take a cannabinoid that may or may not get you high, but will help not only with the pain, but in many cases with the CAUSE.

But taking narcotics is "sane and intelligent."
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


I know smart potheads and I know stoopid potheads... The stoopid outnumber the smart by dozens. I can count the smart on one hand but need two for the stoopid... The only commonality is that they all claim to have a bad memory.

I know a few other people with severe mental illness and we/they all have a bad memory. Smoking something that seems to wreck a person's short term memory seems like a bad idea...
NowIhavetothinkofanameohnoithurts
It's all bull!
Nevertheless, the ruler is not truly wise who cannot discern evils before they develop themselves, and this is a faculty given to few. Niccolo Machiavelli
Karma is funny, people who kick dogs usually get bitten.
If someone doesn't add value to your life, then that someone shouldn't be a part of it.
You can always trust people to do whatever is in their own interests.
It is certain wastelands will be brought under cultivation.
BFD

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wtfdid
 Quoting: Cannabis Kills People


cruise
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BFD

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 Quoting: Cannabis Kills People


U got Chipped.
Conservative Artist
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samuraistuart

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
Been there done that. They most certainly do get you high, and it is different for everyone. Even for me, sometimes they would make me drowsy, sometimes they would wire me up. But I ended up getting addicted to them, and had to get off with the aid of bupe.

I am not one to blame the industry, tho. I take full responsibility for what I did. I knew what I was doing. I chose to take them and get high while treating chronic pain. I got myself addicted to them. I do not, for one second, blame the doctors or the pharma companies...at all. Addiction is NOT a disease, and people who think it is are blatantly dodging the issue and placing blame elsewhere. Sure, addiction can lead to diseases, and body dependence, and a whole host of complications where real diseases arise. But it all starts with a CHOICE. It matters not if you are actually treating chronic pain the best you know how and get addicted, or if you're taking them recreationally and get addicted. Addiction is not a disease, but a choice, and a bad one at that.

It is easy, I get that. I know that. I wish I didn't know how easy it was, I wish I hadn't put myself (and others) through that.
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
It's even worse than traditional Opoids to some since it's also an SNRI. My retarded doctor will mostly only prescribe this to his patients that have chronic pain now. He actually thinks it's less addictive when's it's just as if not more addictive lol. It's also not as helpful for chronic pain. I was on it for a couple years took me a month to ween off followed by a month a withdrawal. It's a lot worse for others though according to some of the stories I've read...

Last Edited by COSMIC WARRIOR on 12/08/2018 02:12 PM
"The syntactical nature of reality, the real secret of magic, is that the world is made of words. And if you know the words that the world is made of, you can make of it whatever you wish."

~ Terence McKenna
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wtfdid
 Quoting: Cannabis Kills People


cruise
 Quoting: BFD


LOOK screenshot:

[link to i.imgur.com (secure)]
[link to i.imgur.com (secure)]

I am not joking wtf

Do the mods know?
Cannabis destroys the heart and vascular system, dangerously lowers blood pressure and causes psychosis and paranoia

Gemma Moss, 31, becomes first woman in Britain to DIE from cannabis poisoning

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TlvmmCpoft

User ID: 77176019
Italy
12/08/2018 02:10 PM
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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
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How can I see a thread and main post by someone on my ignore list?

Clickable link that says "Thread Hidden"????

wtfdid
 Quoting: Cannabis Kills People


cruise
 Quoting: BFD


LOOK screenshot:

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I am not joking wtf

Do the mods know?
 Quoting: Cannabis Kills People


Maybe quit ignoring people? chuckle
I don't know what lies they told you, but I can promise they were lies.

Silencing yourself and living in the dark just means you've left yourself exposed to the type of people who wander the dark looking for victims who won't scream.
MountainTux NLI  (OP)

User ID: 68160495
Canada
12/08/2018 02:13 PM

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Re: Tramadol - the danger and the lies
...


Agreed, but not having ever used opioids or narcotics, I'm not sure of why people would like the high. I've been TOLD it varies from feeling stupid to feeling dead... the thought creeps me out. No thanks!
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


I've never understood getting high as a coping strategy. I think it's like drinking, where people drink to get drunk because they're depressed.
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


I understand, in theory, that people use it to ignore or defer the effects of pain. However, what I DON'T understand is why the SAME people will reject non-pharmaceuticals which not only help to deal with pain, but actually help ti REMEDIATE the issues CAUSING the pain. So, take a narcotic to get you high, or take a cannabinoid that may or may not get you high, but will help not only with the pain, but in many cases with the CAUSE.

But taking narcotics is "sane and intelligent."
 Quoting: MountainTux NLI


I know smart potheads and I know stoopid potheads... The stoopid outnumber the smart by dozens. I can count the smart on one hand but need two for the stoopid... The only commonality is that they all claim to have a bad memory.

I know a few other people with severe mental illness and we/they all have a bad memory. Smoking something that seems to wreck a person's short term memory seems like a bad idea...
 Quoting: NowIhavetothinkofaname


I also know both, but then there's the third category, that people often overlook, and that's "users" that aren't "potheads." I guess it would depend on your definition, but people using marijuana medicinally, whether by prescription, or just responsibly, don't fall into that category IMO.

We won't get into the specifics of whether memory impairment is a "thing" or not (I can tell you in mast cases I have experience with, it's not, but YMMV) but it's also relative. There are people that will abuse or be addicted to anything, and there are those that use responsibly.

I understand why people use prescribed narcotics, I just couldn't do it myself given a safer alternative. I like a beer or cider, but I wouldn't drink to relieve pain.

Everything is relative, and I don't judge those who don't judge me. I simply ask that if people want to discuss these things, they do it with facts, not opinions. You speak from experience, I respect that :) I do the same, and I expect people to respect THAT in turn.

I'm easy to get along with!

hf
ad ignorantiam - The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”





GLP