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If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?

 
TheLordsServant

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02/16/2019 09:33 PM

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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
IF Jesus is God Himself, then the phrase "Son of God" should not even exist.

God Himself has no need for the words or phrases...

"the Father"
"my Father"
"our Father"
"your Father"

God Himself wouldn't refer to His Kingdom as "the kingdom of God"...it would be "My Kingdom".
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


"Jesus" was the "man/flesh" that Housed God. The "man" Christ was just that. A man. Flesh that was mortal and experienced pain, sorrow and death. A flesh in which God himself took on dwelling amongst men and experiencing that which humanity lives.

The being in which he created that Housed God, that died and resurected, now sits at the right hand of the father.

In the beginning the Word was with God (not the flesh man that housed God) AND THE WORD (Not the flesh that housed God) WAS GOD.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


What part of "Son OF God" is it that you can't comprehend?

God Himself didn't come to earth.

He SENT His SON.

iamwith
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


What part of the man/flesh of the mortal man called "Jesus" that housed God himself, that was referenced as the "Son OF God" as mortal flesh. Also known as "The son of man" do you not understand?

You are confusing the carnal with the spiritual. But, then again, that is expected from the carnally minded...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


No I'm not. Your response is typical evangelical bullshite.

Attack the messenger when you can't disprove the bulk of scripture.

The "Son OF God" is exactly that.

And your "Jesus IS God" is false doctrine.

Thread: Son of God - Jesus' Relationship To The Father - John 17 and More
I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
DGN  (OP)

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02/16/2019 09:34 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
Because God created him in "the beginning"?
 Quoting: TGus 74764022


Right,Jesus was the beginning of Jehovah's creation, not the earth as cited in Genesis.
TheLordsServant

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02/16/2019 09:36 PM

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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2019 09:42 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Jesus forgived the thieves on the cross.
TheLordsServant

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02/16/2019 09:57 PM

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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Jesus forgived the thieves on the cross.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77374108


Not both - just one of them.

Matthew 9:6 But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (then saith he to the sick of the palsy,) Arise, take up thy bed, and go unto thine house.

Luke 5:24 But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power upon earth to forgive sins, (he said unto the sick of the palsy,) I say unto thee, Arise, and take up thy couch, and go into thine house.

Jesus also said this on the cross

Luke 23:34 Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots.
I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
DGN  (OP)

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02/16/2019 10:05 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Jesus forgived the thieves on the cross.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77374108


A little fine tuning trivia on judgement;
'Therefore, in response Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these things the Son does also in like manner. 20 For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead up and makes them alive, so the Son also makes alive whomever he wants to. 22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father" Jo5:19
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2019 10:06 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


You are void of scriptural truth. Jesus forgave sins. Why and how could the man Jesus forgive sins? Because it was God in the flesh. That's why.

And here is all the scriptures that state Jesus forgave sins.

[link to www.biblegateway.com (secure)]
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2019 10:12 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Jesus forgived the thieves on the cross.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77374108


A little fine tuning trivia on judgement;
'Therefore, in response Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these things the Son does also in like manner. 20 For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead up and makes them alive, so the Son also makes alive whomever he wants to. 22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father" Jo5:19
 Quoting: DGN


"So all may honor the son JUST AS the honor the Father".

Say, did you notice that? Probably not and will likely have an excuse to diminish it.

Honor the son JUST AS they Honor the father. "JUST AS" means with EQUALITY.

I bet that just grates at your spirit to think Jesus be honored with Equality...
TheLordsServant

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02/16/2019 10:15 PM

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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
A little fine tuning trivia on judgement;
'Therefore, in response Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these things the Son does also in like manner. 20 For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead up and makes them alive, so the Son also makes alive whomever he wants to. 22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father" Jo5:19
 Quoting: DGN


"So all may honor the son JUST AS the honor the Father".

Say, did you notice that? Probably not and will likely have an excuse to diminish it.

Honor the son JUST AS they Honor the father. "JUST AS" means with EQUALITY.

I bet that just grates at your spirit to think Jesus be honored with Equality...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


Honoring Him is not total equality. And Jesus' own words tell us different.

...the Father is GREATER than I. John 14:28
...I do ONLY the Father's Will. John 6:37-39
...I PRAY to the Father. Matthew 26:36-42, Mark 14:32-39 & John 17
...I say what the Father has said. John 12:49-50
...I learned / do as the Father has showed me. John 5:19
...I give THANKS to the Father. John 11:41
...I don't KNOW when I will return...ONLY the Father KNOWS. Matthew 24:36
...I tell you to ask the Father in MY name. John 14:13
...I go to sit at the Father's right hand. Matthew 26:64
...I ASCEND to the Father, MY GOD and YOUR GOD. John 20:17
...the Father has given me authority. Matthew 28:18
...only the Father is good.. Luke 18:19
I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
DGN  (OP)

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02/16/2019 10:16 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Jesus forgived the thieves on the cross.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77374108


A little fine tuning trivia on judgement;
'Therefore, in response Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these things the Son does also in like manner. 20 For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead up and makes them alive, so the Son also makes alive whomever he wants to. 22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father" Jo5:19
 Quoting: DGN


"So all may honor the son JUST AS the honor the Father".

Say, did you notice that? Probably not and will likely have an excuse to diminish it.

Honor the son JUST AS they Honor the father. "JUST AS" means with EQUALITY.

I bet that just grates at your spirit to think Jesus be honored with Equality...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


How do you honor Jehovah?
TheLordsServant

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02/16/2019 10:17 PM

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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Jesus forgived the thieves on the cross.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77374108


A little fine tuning trivia on judgement;
'Therefore, in response Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these things the Son does also in like manner. 20 For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead up and makes them alive, so the Son also makes alive whomever he wants to. 22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father" Jo5:19
 Quoting: DGN


Judgement is at the end times, which is when Jesus will judge.

The Father "has entrusted" judging to Jesus.

hi
I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2019 10:18 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
I testify against you that this Jesus is God
incarnate.You will give an account for
leading souls into deception.You are a
card carrying member of the Jehovah's witness
cult. It's hard for you to kick against the pricks.


Titus 2:13

"Looking for that blessed hope and the glorious
appearing of the Great God and Savior Jesus Christ"

Isaiah 9:6 might help you "see"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76793941


Flattery is a transparent cheap shot idolatrous merry-go-round that will lead you right back where you started
"Jesus spoke these things, and raising his eyes to heaven, he said: “Father, the hour has come. Glorify your son so that your son may glorify you, 2 just as you have given him authority over all flesh, so that he may give everlasting life to all those whom you have given to him. 3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ. 4 I have glorified you on the earth, having finished the work you have given me to do. 5 So now, Father, glorify me at your side with the glory that I had alongside you before the world was." Jo17:3
 Quoting: DGN


just as you have given him authority over all flesh, so that he may give everlasting life to all those whom you have given to him


So now, Father, glorify me at your side with the glory that I HAD alongside you BEFORE the world was.

Did you switch sides with this post or are you unaware of what you posted? The scripture you posted tells us Jesus has authority of ALL flesh and that he had glory alongside the Father before the creation of the world.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2019 10:20 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
...


Jesus forgived the thieves on the cross.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77374108


A little fine tuning trivia on judgement;
'Therefore, in response Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these things the Son does also in like manner. 20 For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead up and makes them alive, so the Son also makes alive whomever he wants to. 22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father" Jo5:19
 Quoting: DGN


"So all may honor the son JUST AS the honor the Father".

Say, did you notice that? Probably not and will likely have an excuse to diminish it.

Honor the son JUST AS they Honor the father. "JUST AS" means with EQUALITY.

I bet that just grates at your spirit to think Jesus be honored with Equality...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


How do you honor Jehovah?
 Quoting: DGN


By exposing cults in sheep's clothing.

No seriously, "I" don't. Not "I" but it is Christ in me...
TheLordsServant

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02/16/2019 10:21 PM

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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


You are void of scriptural truth. Jesus forgave sins. Why and how could the man Jesus forgive sins? Because it was God in the flesh. That's why.

And here is all the scriptures that state Jesus forgave sins.

[link to www.biblegateway.com (secure)]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


Just because Jesus forgave sins doesn't mean that He's the originator.

The Father obviously GAVE Him the right to forgive, just as Jesus told the Apostles that they could forgive.

You're void of the Father...you haven't been allowed to talk to Him yet because of your nasty attitude.

verysad
I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
TheLordsServant

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02/16/2019 10:24 PM

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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"So all may honor the son JUST AS the honor the Father".

Say, did you notice that? Probably not and will likely have an excuse to diminish it.

Honor the son JUST AS they Honor the father. "JUST AS" means with EQUALITY.

I bet that just grates at your spirit to think Jesus be honored with Equality...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


How do you honor Jehovah?
 Quoting: DGN


By exposing cults in sheep's clothing.

No seriously, "I" don't. Not "I" but it is Christ in me...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


Trinitarianism is a cult that's been around for 1800 years.

Jesus never said He was equal to God.

But you folks just can't comprehend scripture.
I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2019 10:28 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
Because God created him in "the beginning"?
 Quoting: TGus 74764022


Right,Jesus was the beginning of Jehovah's creation, not the earth as cited in Genesis.
 Quoting: DGN


Huh I thought you were Jewish not a JW. Jesus calls himself Lord of the Sabbath. The Jews attempted to stone him after he said Abraham rejoiced for his day and when he said before Abram was "I am". They took this as him calling himself God which is why they tried to stone him

He says in John 10:38 the Father is not only in him but the Son in the Father.

“You call Me Teacher and Lord; and you are right, for so I am.” (John 13:13)

Exodus 33:20
But," he said, "you cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live."

Exodus 33:11
The LORD would speak to Moses face to face, as one speaks to a friend. Then Moses would return to the camp, but his young aide Joshua son of Nun did not leave the tent.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2019 10:29 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


You are void of scriptural truth. Jesus forgave sins. Why and how could the man Jesus forgive sins? Because it was God in the flesh. That's why.

And here is all the scriptures that state Jesus forgave sins.

[link to www.biblegateway.com (secure)]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


Just because Jesus forgave sins doesn't mean that He's the originator.

The Father obviously GAVE Him the right to forgive, just as Jesus told the Apostles that they could forgive.

You're void of the Father...you haven't been allowed to talk to Him yet because of your nasty attitude.

verysad
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


"You Fools! You Hypocrites! You Snakes!"
Meet the Real Jesus Many Hate

Jesus called the Scribes and Pharisees "fools, hypocrites, blind guides, whited sepulchers, murderers, a generation of snakes," and many such epithets. Jesus called them "hypocrites" seven times in one chapter. He spoke with scathing derision to the Scribes and Pharisees throughout His ministry; very few of them received a kind word from Him.

And yet Christians write and say Im void of the Father. Was Jesus void of the Father? Or other tell me that Jesus never spoke like this or ever said a cruel or angry word in His life. Therefore when I sometimes write with an edge on my voice I am accused of not following the example of Jesus. Oh but Jesus surely did speak harshly, demeaningly, and with great anger in His voice to the Scribes and Pharisees - the religious Leaders of God's Church. Jesus was not mild and soft-spoken when it came to the sins and hypocrisy of these church leaders. Too many Christians have read the teachings of Jesus with rose-colored glasses covering both their eyes and their minds.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2019 10:33 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"So all may honor the son JUST AS the honor the Father".

Say, did you notice that? Probably not and will likely have an excuse to diminish it.

Honor the son JUST AS they Honor the father. "JUST AS" means with EQUALITY.

I bet that just grates at your spirit to think Jesus be honored with Equality...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


How do you honor Jehovah?
 Quoting: DGN


By exposing cults in sheep's clothing.

No seriously, "I" don't. Not "I" but it is Christ in me...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


Trinitarianism is a cult that's been around for 1800 years.

Jesus never said He was equal to God.

But you folks just can't comprehend scripture.
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Not once did I promote trinitarism. You apparently lack good reading and comprehension skills.
Anonymous Coward
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02/16/2019 10:45 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
...



"Jesus" was the "man/flesh" that Housed God. The "man" Christ was just that. A man. Flesh that was mortal and experienced pain, sorrow and death. A flesh in which God himself took on dwelling amongst men and experiencing that which humanity lives.

The being in which he created that Housed God, that died and resurected, now sits at the right hand of the father.

In the beginning the Word was with God (not the flesh man that housed God) AND THE WORD (Not the flesh that housed God) WAS GOD.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73015805


DGN is a Jehovah's witness, and TheLordsServant may be as well. No use arguing with them since they adamantly deny the deity of Christ. I'm sure they denounce the doctrine of predestination as well and believe they have saved themselves with their own ability to believe.

If God chooses to reveal the truth to them, He will in His time.
 Quoting: NoFriendOfTheWorld

"I'm sure they denounce the doctrine of predestination as well"
If the blasphemy of predestination is true who is accountable for sin/crime genocides?
 Quoting: DGN


Let's let the scriptures answer.

Romans 11:32

"For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all."

So I ask you DGN. Who is responsible for bounding EVERYONE over to disobedience, so the he may have mercy on THEM ALL ?

Further:

Romans 8:29-30


29 For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; 30 and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.

So, now talk to us about how Paul taught blasphemy of predestination.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


bump for DGN or the Lord's truth or whatever he calls himself, to retort.
DGN  (OP)

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02/16/2019 11:56 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
"Jesus Saves" is a popular phrase and even a song title.

Yet...Who actually forgives our sins? Jesus TELLS us.

Matthew 6

14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:

15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


horn2
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Jesus forgived the thieves on the cross.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77374108


A little fine tuning trivia on judgement;
'Therefore, in response Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these things the Son does also in like manner. 20 For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead up and makes them alive, so the Son also makes alive whomever he wants to. 22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father" Jo5:19
 Quoting: DGN


Judgement is at the end times, which is when Jesus will judge.

The Father "has entrusted" judging to Jesus.

hi
 Quoting: TheLordsServant

Yes the final judgement for salvation at the end of the 1,000 years. Coming upon this world soon is the Armageddon judgement, deciding who in current time will be granted deliverance thru the tribulation, a 'great crowd' yes but extremely few. Rv7:14
DGN  (OP)

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02/16/2019 11:58 PM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
...


Jesus forgived the thieves on the cross.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77374108


A little fine tuning trivia on judgement;
'Therefore, in response Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, the Son cannot do a single thing of his own initiative, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever things that One does, these things the Son does also in like manner. 20 For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does, and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead up and makes them alive, so the Son also makes alive whomever he wants to. 22 For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son, 23 so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father" Jo5:19
 Quoting: DGN


Judgement is at the end times, which is when Jesus will judge.

The Father "has entrusted" judging to Jesus.

hi
 Quoting: TheLordsServant

Yes the final judgement for salvation at the end of the 1,000 years. Coming upon this world soon is the Armageddon judgement, deciding who in current time will be granted deliverance thru the tribulation, a 'great crowd' yes but extremely few. Rv7:14

 Quoting: DGN

Issac

User ID: 77170338
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02/17/2019 12:54 AM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
God being born through mother Mary is both God and Son of God. Jesus is definitely a God, and since there is one God..

Hebrews 1:5-14 King James Version (KJV)
5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:

11 They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;

12 And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.

13 But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Last Edited by Issac on 02/17/2019 05:37 PM
Visit this site to learn about those who are spreading 666. Could THELEMA be the beast of revelations?


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And I quote, "I bind my blood in Satan's hands, All this that lieth betwixt my hands, To thee, the Beast, and thy control, I pledge me; body, mind, and soul. (Aleister Crowley, Satanic Extracts, 1991)"





Revelation 13:4
And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
Anonymous Coward
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02/17/2019 01:38 AM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
So was Jesus created by God or what?
 Quoting: DGN


Yes. Anybody who says Jesus is the same person as God the Father or that he always co-existed with God is in error.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77375570


uuuh,what bible are you quoting from ?
does it contain JOHN 1 ?

read it online then.
DGN  (OP)

User ID: 76673672
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02/17/2019 01:44 AM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
So was Jesus created by God or what?
 Quoting: DGN


Yes. Anybody who says Jesus is the same person as God the Father or that he always co-existed with God is in error.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77375570


uuuh,what bible are you quoting from ?
does it contain JOHN 1 ?

read it online then.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77289551

Read this right here, or go chase validation for your brazin defiance;

"So the Word became flesh and resided among us, and we had a view of his glory, a glory such as belongs to an only-begotten son from a father; and he was full of divine favor and truth. 15 (John bore witness about him, yes, he cried out: “This was the one of whom I said, ‘The one coming behind me has advanced in front of me, for he existed before me.’”) 16 For we all received from his fullness, even undeserved kindness upon undeserved kindness. 17 Because the Law was given through Moses, the undeserved kindness and the truth came to be through Jesus Christ. 18 No man has seen God at any time; the only-begotten god who is at the Father’s side is the one who has explained Him." Jo1

Last Edited by DGN on 02/17/2019 01:45 AM
Anonymous Coward
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02/17/2019 01:48 AM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
Hey tards... if you are not genetically related to the chosen you're a dsmn fool for believing their religion. May your kin have mercy on your souls when you awake in Yygdrasil.
DGN  (OP)

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02/17/2019 01:49 AM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
Hey tards... if you are not genetically related to the chosen you're a dsmn fool for believing their religion. May your kin have mercy on your souls when you awake in Yygdrasil.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77360040


Hey thanks for the heads up.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 77360040
United States
02/17/2019 01:52 AM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
Hey tards... if you are not genetically related to the chosen you're a dsmn fool for believing their religion. May your kin have mercy on your souls when you awake in Yygdrasil.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77360040


Hey thanks for the heads up.
 Quoting: DGN


Sure thing JW, spreading your religious filth. Soon, very soon your publishing company will be broke from all the lawsuits...
TheLordsServant

User ID: 77382790
United States
02/17/2019 11:37 AM

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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
By exposing cults in sheep's clothing.

No seriously, "I" don't. Not "I" but it is Christ in me...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


Trinitarianism is a cult that's been around for 1800 years.

Jesus never said He was equal to God.

But you folks just can't comprehend scripture.
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Not once did I promote trinitarism. You apparently lack good reading and comprehension skills.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 73759913


"Jesus is God Himself" is just one step off the trinitarian bandwagon.

Your lack of explanation doesn't equate to your perceived assesment of my skills.

The FACT of scripture states that Jesus is the Son OF God.

Not God Himself.

You refuse to accept the vast majority of scriptural evidence that supports such truth, chosing to use cherry-picked verses to prove your false doctrine.
I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
TheLordsServant

User ID: 77382790
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02/17/2019 11:41 AM

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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
God being born through mother Mary is both God and Son of God.

Hebrews 1:5-14 King James Version (KJV)
5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:

11 They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;

12 And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.

13 But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?
 Quoting: Issac

It's sad that you folks ignore what Jesus actually states in favor of what humans stated.

Jesus said all of these. Did He lie?

...the Father is GREATER than I. John 14:28
...I do ONLY the Father's Will. John 6:37-39
...I PRAY to the Father. Matthew 26:36-42, Mark 14:32-39 & John 17
...I say what the Father has said. John 12:49-50
...I learned / do as the Father has showed me. John 5:19
...I give THANKS to the Father. John 11:41
...I don't KNOW when I will return...ONLY the Father KNOWS. Matthew 24:36
...I tell you to ask the Father in MY name. John 14:13
...I go to sit at the Father's right hand. Matthew 26:64
...I ASCEND to the Father, MY GOD and YOUR GOD. John 20:17
...the Father has given me authority. Matthew 28:18
...only the Father is good.. Luke 18:19
I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
DGN  (OP)

User ID: 76673672
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02/17/2019 11:45 AM
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Re: If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?
God being born through mother Mary is both God and Son of God.

Hebrews 1:5-14 King James Version (KJV)
5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:

11 They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;

12 And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.

13 But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?

14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?
 Quoting: Issac

It's sad that you folks ignore what Jesus actually states in favor of what humans stated.

Jesus said all of these. Did He lie?

...the Father is GREATER than I. John 14:28
...I do ONLY the Father's Will. John 6:37-39
...I PRAY to the Father. Matthew 26:36-42, Mark 14:32-39 & John 17
...I say what the Father has said. John 12:49-50
...I learned / do as the Father has showed me. John 5:19
...I give THANKS to the Father. John 11:41
...I don't KNOW when I will return...ONLY the Father KNOWS. Matthew 24:36
...I tell you to ask the Father in MY name. John 14:13
...I go to sit at the Father's right hand. Matthew 26:64
...I ASCEND to the Father, MY GOD and YOUR GOD. John 20:17
...the Father has given me authority. Matthew 28:18
...only the Father is good.. Luke 18:19
 Quoting: TheLordsServant


Why is such simple truth beyond understanding, even for 'believers'?
" If, in fact, the good news we declare is veiled, it is veiled among those who are perishing, 4 among whom the god of this system of things has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, so that the illumination of the glorious good news about the Christ, who is the image of God, might not shine through. 5 For we are preaching, not about ourselves, but about Jesus Christ as Lord and ourselves as your slaves for Jesus’ sake. 6 For God is the one who said: “Let the light shine out of darkness,” and he has shone on our hearts to illuminate them with the glorious knowledge of God by the face of Christ." 2Cor4;3