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Microbiologist friends, I need some help.

 
~ CITRONELLA ~
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User ID: 76640758
Canada
04/12/2019 05:06 PM

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Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
This is a very specific question. How does one prevent enterococci from becoming resistant while treating it with a quinolone antibiotic.

Does it help to keep the ph at a certain level? Does it help to cut off carbs? Take saccromyces? take NAC? Take a few days of a second antibiotic? Take metronidazole with it/after it? Take oil of oregano with it? How does one prevent this possibility?

I've attached a reference article so if anyone can explain how this works to me, I have too much going on right now and I don't have the time to research it. I figure if anyone would know it would be a genius over yonder.

If anyone has this specific answer and can explain how it happens and how to prevent it that would be so appreciated.

Also no lectures about rupturing tendons, I'm aware.

Asking for a friend... of course... lol.

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~ CITRONELLA ~
SloGenPhys

User ID: 29237879
United States
04/12/2019 05:31 PM
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Re: Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
For what it's worth...

The population of bacteria within your gut will carry myriad mutations among the same strain. In other words, the seeds for resisting medications, antibacterials, etc. already exist in the bacterial populations targeted for destruction.

You carry enterococci in your gut. These enterococci are not genetically identical. Some are already resistant. When you take an antibiotic, it targets those lineages that are not resistant. The result is that you have selected for the resistant lineages by killing off the non-resistant competition. You have promoted the proliferation of the already-resistant enterococci.

Treatments may attempt to get around this by including multiple antibacterial strategies simultaneously, creating a broader scope of attack to include more lineages of enterococci. But in the end, there likely still exists some lineages that carry mutations conferring resistance to each of the strategies used. And these unique strains will survive.

Health is a matter of repressing the proliferation of pathogenic gut flora by making the environment particularly suitable for healthy bacteria. The healthy gut flora then out competes the unhealthy flora.

For perspective, btw... you have more total cells of other species on your body right now than you have human cells. This can be so because bacterial cells are much smaller than "human" cells. And this population of cells usually function in a mutually-agreeable synergistic complimentary fashion. Imbalances in human health change conditions in the body that tend to promote unhealthy flora over healthy flora. And antibacterials nuke everything indiscriminately, killing both beneficial and pathogenic species. Which is why eating fermented foods, yogurt, and taking healthy probiotics is essential, especially when taking antibacterials. You have to repopulate healthy flora.

Last Edited by SloGenPhys on 04/12/2019 05:44 PM
SloGenPhys
~ CITRONELLA ~  (OP)

User ID: 76640758
Canada
04/12/2019 06:48 PM

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Re: Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
For what it's worth...

The population of bacteria within your gut will carry myriad mutations among the same strain. In other words, the seeds for resisting medications, antibacterials, etc. already exist in the bacterial populations targeted for destruction.

You carry enterococci in your gut. These enterococci are not genetically identical. Some are already resistant. When you take an antibiotic, it targets those lineages that are not resistant. The result is that you have selected for the resistant lineages by killing off the non-resistant competition. You have promoted the proliferation of the already-resistant enterococci.

Treatments may attempt to get around this by including multiple antibacterial strategies simultaneously, creating a broader scope of attack to include more lineages of enterococci. But in the end, there likely still exists some lineages that carry mutations conferring resistance to each of the strategies used. And these unique strains will survive.

Health is a matter of repressing the proliferation of pathogenic gut flora by making the environment particularly suitable for healthy bacteria. The healthy gut flora then out competes the unhealthy flora.

For perspective, btw... you have more total cells of other species on your body right now than you have human cells. This can be so because bacterial cells are much smaller than "human" cells. And this population of cells usually function in a mutually-agreeable synergistic complimentary fashion. Imbalances in human health change conditions in the body that tend to promote unhealthy flora over healthy flora. And antibacterials nuke everything indiscriminately, killing both beneficial and pathogenic species. Which is why eating fermented foods, yogurt, and taking healthy probiotics is essential, especially when taking antibacterials. You have to repopulate healthy flora.
 Quoting: SloGenPhys


Thank you for your reply. I fully agree with you regarding the aspect of gut flora. I know exactly what you are saying and that is why this is such a difficult issue to deal with but unfortunately it needs to be done. Do you know of any specific flora that competes directly with enterococci. Would an acceptable answer be to treat the full population and hope to kill as much as possible, and then use specific probiotics, immediately after or during to repopulate? Problem is that this has escaped outside the gut and no amount of probiotics and fermented foods are sufficient. it requires abx.

Background At some point, said friend had to deal with a stealth organism, and she was extremely fortunate to beat it, but now abx use has resulted in gut population disturbances. It slowly gets better with time, but this current situation was an unfortunate result of a trip to a hospital to visit a friend.

It is not resistant, but likely also not of the original resident population and probably acquired in hospital. So yes, maybe figuring out which probiotics its competition is?

If it has to be done, I'm just figuring out how to do it to obtain the optimum result and prevent any damage. Thanks.
~ CITRONELLA ~
SloGenPhys

User ID: 29237879
United States
04/12/2019 07:29 PM
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Re: Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
Your friend obviously has an undiagnosed systemic imbalance. And has exhausted everything Western Medicine has to offer. That's good.

This is where I tell people they have an opportunity to heal. My Western education includes medical school. I know it's limitations. But it doesn't matter what I know. Once your friend is forced to look elsewhere, solutions and remedies may begin to manifest.

I would suggest locating an Eastern therapist. Or maybe even an East/ West clinic should one be readily available. Have the pulses evaluated by an Ayurvedic practitioner. One aspect of treatment will be dietary and nutritional assessment and direction. That's a great place to start. But be ready to abandon things like wheat gluten/ glyphosphate contaminated grains, and all processed foods.

Also look into the diagnostic technology and work of Dr. Jerry Tennant. His work is dead on and extenuates Eastern medical predicates into a Western interpretive framework.

Bottom line, forget tackling the symptoms and focus identifying the systemic etiology. This means behavioral change where necessary.
SloGenPhys
~ CITRONELLA ~  (OP)

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04/13/2019 12:44 AM

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Re: Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
Actually she exhausts both eastern and western medicine. Said friend is GF, DF and organic already. Thank you for replying. I will look into the book writen by this individual you mentioned. I'm a firm believer that when you seek knowledge, and if it is given to you, you should follow up. You didn't just reply by random chance, I am meant to read the book. :)
~ CITRONELLA ~
ol' scratch
User ID: 77554341
United Kingdom
04/13/2019 01:17 AM
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Re: Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
What about you Flora, You want some mora?

What about you fauna, Do you wanna?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 77388742
New Zealand
04/13/2019 07:29 PM
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Re: Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
i was going to suggest Ayurveda, you will need to ascertain your body type, or Dosha, it really is, no pun intended , the shit!! you need to repopulate your gut with friendly bacteria and fermented foods is the way to go, just start slowly! a lot of the "woody" spices included in your diet, such as cinnamon ( not cassia) cloves, cardamon are very good anti bad bug spices. I would also recommend reducing the pharma meds, get into fasting, one day a week to begin with, and eliminate as many processed carbs as possible. Psychiatric meds can affect your gut flora as well, stress can create a more acidic environment in which the non beneficial bacteria can grow , i also recommend getting some psylium husk into your diet, exercise regularly, and be patient... speaking from personal experience :) good luck!! and if you can find one, go seek out a neurolink practioner ( not to be confused with Fucklon Musks neuralink brain interface headwear lol)
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 77388742
New Zealand
04/13/2019 07:30 PM
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Re: Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
What about you Flora, You want some mora?

What about you fauna, Do you wanna?
 Quoting: ol' scratch 77554341


hahaha yay!! its frank zappa day!! :D

banana2

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~ CITRONELLA ~  (OP)

User ID: 76640758
Canada
04/15/2019 12:52 AM

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Re: Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
i was going to suggest , you will need to ascertain your body type, or Dosha, it really is, no pun intended , the shit!! you need to repopulate your gut with friendly bacteria and fermented foods is the way to go, just start slowly! a lot of the "woody" spices included in your diet, such as cinnamon ( not cassia) cloves, cardamon are very good anti bad bug spices. I would also recommend reducing the pharma meds, get into fasting, one day a week to begin with, and eliminate as many processed carbs as possible. Psychiatric meds can affect your gut flora as well, stress can create a more acidic environment in which the non beneficial bacteria can grow , i also recommend getting some psylium husk into your diet, exercise regularly, and be patient... speaking from personal experience :) good luck!! and if you can find one, go seek out a neurolink practioner ( not to be confused with Fucklon Musks neuralink brain interface headwear lol)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77388742


.
I did Ayurveda when I was young, and didn't find it very useful to be honest. I eat woody spices every day, don't take any Pharma meds, (well except the medicine I have to take for this issue right now.) Don't eat many carbs in general, don't take psychiatric meds, have a lot of stress through, ridiculous amounts. Thanks for the psyllium reminder. That was on my list of things to do. I will look into neurolink. Don't even know what it is but I love to learn. Stress can cause such problems. I think my immune system was really low as I was under ridiculous amounts of stress when I was exposed to this germ. Wrong place at such a wrong time. I don't know much about Dosha either but I will look it up as well, especially if its the shit lol Thanks for all the information.
~ CITRONELLA ~
Timur2020

User ID: 71913655
United States
04/15/2019 01:07 AM

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Re: Microbiologist friends, I need some help.
Its so vague and full of odd speculations I'm just gonna let the would be witchdoctors have this one.

If it was pervasive i would kill it and ensure a good probiotic restart - but its vague and the question itself is a bit off.....what is the priority concern about resistance? Having some mexican gut plague up there? Is it really bacteria or microbes?

There are enough good suggestions already.
"Science without religion is lame; religion without science is blind"

Covid, fake riots, communist organizers - keep your powder dry America. This was not the disease or the riots, those both are still on down the line.
Garden garden grow spices and medical plants too.

I am a VeterAid volunteer for Arrogant Mushroom Healers of Alamogordo.





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