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the Fear of God

 
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 517558
Canada
03/29/2009 09:15 PM
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Re: the Fear of God

Well actually it doesn't.

It's just what you were taught to keep you from questioning!
Have you ever met a small child who doesn't question?? This is how understanding grows and this is what Jesus taught - to become as a little child! There is, however, a difference between questioning to learn and questioning because of doubt. I believe we are expected to want to learn and hence to question.
 Quoting: Servant


Sorry, but it does. We read that book from cover to cover and had to write endless essays on it. I read that passage a couple of times myself and we had one class discussion on it that I can remember.

I haven't picked up a Bible since High School, and that was a good 10 years ago. Too bad I threw out my notebooks; my Religion binder would have come in handy many times on GLP. lol

I agree with you in that religious children are taught NOT to think; that's actually why I turned away from Catholicism and Christianity. None of my questions were met with answers that actually made sense.
Sombra  (OP)

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03/29/2009 09:16 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Well, for christians, it's scripture. And I'm talking generally. We should realize that if we cheat to get ahead, it'll catch up to us. In an obvious example, televangelists can't screw around under the table and stay hidden. And yet, so many think they can. They don't take God seriously on his word. They think it somehow doesn't apply to them.


Speaking of televangelists, have any of you non-Christians seen Joel and Victoria Osteen?

BIGGEST fakes. They are so transparent, it's embarrassing.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 517558


Why would you be embarrassed for someone else's behaviour?
Sombra  (OP)

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03/29/2009 09:18 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
How do you question the Holy Spirit? Sounds a lot like my experience of being called a blashpemer because I read the bible myself instead of letting the sunday school teacher tell me what it said.


Questioning whether the Holy Spirit exists is enough, according to the Bible.

My God, you think your teacher would have ENCOURAGED you to read it, not called you a blasphemer.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 517558


I suspect the teacher had not read it herself.
Sombra  (OP)

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03/29/2009 09:20 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Well, for christians, it's scripture. And I'm talking generally. We should realize that if we cheat to get ahead, it'll catch up to us. In an obvious example, televangelists can't screw around under the table and stay hidden. And yet, so many think they can. They don't take God seriously on his word. They think it somehow doesn't apply to them.


Speaking of televangelists, have any of you non-Christians seen Joel and Victoria Osteen?

BIGGEST fakes. They are so transparent, it's embarrassing.


I know someone who goes to a church north of Dallas that just broke ground on a new building that's supposed to cost like $22 million. Talk about one expensive idol.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 633680



I think that is a low budget church here in Dallas.
Anonymous Coward
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03/29/2009 09:21 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Speaking of televangelists, have any of you non-Christians seen Joel and Victoria Osteen?

BIGGEST fakes. They are so transparent, it's embarrassing.


Why would you be embarrassed for someone else's behaviour?
 Quoting: Sombra


Have you ever looked away in embarrassment FOR another when they make themselves look like an ass? In life, in movies, etc?

That's what I mean. It's not a personal embarrassment.
Anonymous Coward
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03/29/2009 09:21 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
ok let's just assume for the sake of argument God does
exist... even if you're an atheist pretend you're in a philosophy class and you're fleshing out the logic of various particular arguments. ok if you assume God exists as described in the bible then unless you're a fan of eternal "punishment" (various interpretations here left aside) it would be wise to fear him as it would be wise to fear a box jelly fish.

I think the more interesting question would be... if God exists why would he want you to fear him... one obvious answer would be that he loves people and would rather not have to "punish" them in keeping w/ his just character.

Fear is the "beginning" of wisdom hopefully not the culmination one might argue


The problem is attributing human emotions and thinking to god, which is ludicrous. If god cared whether we ate meat on friday or had abortions, those things would be impossible, god would not allow it, we would have no choice. All the rules attributed to god's word are made up by humans who need to control others or who want to punish themselves and each other.
 Quoting: Sombra


if you re-read your quote carefully I think you'll notice that you're falling guity to the very thing you claim would necessarily make something impossible.
Anonymous Coward
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03/29/2009 09:22 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
It means to take him serious. Christians are told "God is not mocked" and reminded that we reap what we sow, with the mockery consisting of us not *really* thinking we'll reap what we sow, and believing that we can somehow "get away" with inappropriate conduct.


Who determines what is inappropriate conduct?


Well, for christians, it's scripture. And I'm talking generally. We should realize that if we cheat to get ahead, it'll catch up to us. In an obvious example, televangelists can't screw around under the table and stay hidden. And yet, so many think they can. They don't take God seriously on his word. They think it somehow doesn't apply to them.


Ok. Does god tell you directly what is inappropriate or are you born knowing it? Or is there someone you beleive has god's ear and exists to tell you what is inappropriate? It all boils down to what each of us thinks and two people who profess to the same beleifs will pick and choose totally different things that are inappropriate. The justifications for the choices will be very similar, though, which I find intersting. Your example of the televangilists who believe they can get away with conduct you consider inappropriate. They have chosen the belief that that conduct is not inappropriate, maybe because they think they are above the law or maybe because they just really think it is ok. And it boils down to everyone has their own personal list of things they will feel guilty for doing.
 Quoting: Sombra


We're pretty much o the same page, then. Paul says at one point "All things are lawful, but not all things edify", and encourages each of us to settle these kinds of matters in our own heart. The example is given that some folks are fine eating meat that was offered to idols, while others' conscience has a problem with it.

Generally, if we have the "fear of God", we'll act in such a way that shows we take Him serious. Some people are all talk, and declare one thing while living something totally contradictory.
Aquarius 7

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03/29/2009 09:26 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
What does that mean? Is it literal or figurative, does it have some obtuse meaning that has nothing to do with fear?

Thanks.
 Quoting: Sombra

. .

Think about it in conjunction with "As ye sow, so shall ye reap."

Or in the words of Edmond Markam:

"There is a destiny which makes us brothers,
none goes his way alone;

All that we send into the lives of others,
comes back into our own."


Think about it in terms of The Universal Law of Cause and Effect.

Think on these things ... and you will begin to understand the meaning of "fear".

imho
.

Cayce: The greater portion of Japan must go into the sea. . then we may know it has begun . www.near-death.com/experiences/cayce11.html
.
"Be kind, for everyone you know is fighting a hard battle" - Plato
.
"Those who are at peace in their hearts already are in the Great Shelter of life." ~ Hopi Prophecy
.
Sombra  (OP)

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03/29/2009 09:26 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Speaking of televangelists, have any of you non-Christians seen Joel and Victoria Osteen?

BIGGEST fakes. They are so transparent, it's embarrassing.


Why would you be embarrassed for someone else's behaviour?


Have you ever looked away in embarrassment FOR another when they make themselves look like an ass? In life, in movies, etc?

That's what I mean. It's not a personal embarrassment.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 517558



Oh, I don't think so but I understand what you mean.

You have to give them credit though, they were on Larry King. :) Their abundance god works for them.
Sombra  (OP)

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03/29/2009 09:29 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
ok let's just assume for the sake of argument God does
exist... even if you're an atheist pretend you're in a philosophy class and you're fleshing out the logic of various particular arguments. ok if you assume God exists as described in the bible then unless you're a fan of eternal "punishment" (various interpretations here left aside) it would be wise to fear him as it would be wise to fear a box jelly fish.

I think the more interesting question would be... if God exists why would he want you to fear him... one obvious answer would be that he loves people and would rather not have to "punish" them in keeping w/ his just character.

Fear is the "beginning" of wisdom hopefully not the culmination one might argue


The problem is attributing human emotions and thinking to god, which is ludicrous. If god cared whether we ate meat on friday or had abortions, those things would be impossible, god would not allow it, we would have no choice. All the rules attributed to god's word are made up by humans who need to control others or who want to punish themselves and each other.


if you re-read your quote carefully I think you'll notice that you're falling guity to the very thing you claim would necessarily make something impossible.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 645533


Maybe. It just doesn't make sense that a god would create something it is displeased with and let it continue to exist. Humans do that all the time, but why would a god?
Anonymous Coward
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03/29/2009 09:29 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Actually....the word fear was changed from the true meaning of "reverence, or awe".

We shouldn't ever fear "God"....only be awed by the awesomeness of it all.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 642515

I have to disagree! Satan didn't kill a single person in the bible but god kills millions! Be afraid, Be very afraid!
Sombra  (OP)

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03/29/2009 09:34 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
It means to take him serious. Christians are told "God is not mocked" and reminded that we reap what we sow, with the mockery consisting of us not *really* thinking we'll reap what we sow, and believing that we can somehow "get away" with inappropriate conduct.


Who determines what is inappropriate conduct?


Well, for christians, it's scripture. And I'm talking generally. We should realize that if we cheat to get ahead, it'll catch up to us. In an obvious example, televangelists can't screw around under the table and stay hidden. And yet, so many think they can. They don't take God seriously on his word. They think it somehow doesn't apply to them.


Ok. Does god tell you directly what is inappropriate or are you born knowing it? Or is there someone you beleive has god's ear and exists to tell you what is inappropriate? It all boils down to what each of us thinks and two people who profess to the same beleifs will pick and choose totally different things that are inappropriate. The justifications for the choices will be very similar, though, which I find intersting. Your example of the televangilists who believe they can get away with conduct you consider inappropriate. They have chosen the belief that that conduct is not inappropriate, maybe because they think they are above the law or maybe because they just really think it is ok. And it boils down to everyone has their own personal list of things they will feel guilty for doing.


We're pretty much o the same page, then. Paul says at one point "All things are lawful, but not all things edify", and encourages each of us to settle these kinds of matters in our own heart. The example is given that some folks are fine eating meat that was offered to idols, while others' conscience has a problem with it.

Generally, if we have the "fear of God", we'll act in such a way that shows we take Him serious. Some people are all talk, and declare one thing while living something totally contradictory.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 633680


and some people don't think it is appropriate to call god a 'him'. It is all in what we think we need, what we fear, what we want, how we identify ourselves. Just like going into a psychiatrists office, in order to go into a church we have to make ourselves smaller than we really are.
Sombra  (OP)

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03/29/2009 09:41 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Actually....the word fear was changed from the true meaning of "reverence, or awe".

We shouldn't ever fear "God"....only be awed by the awesomeness of it all.

I have to disagree! Satan didn't kill a single person in the bible but god kills millions! Be afraid, Be very afraid!
 Quoting: The Antichrist 666


The existence of satan is another thing that makes no sense to me. Mainly because if god created the universe and all that is in it, why would god create a nemisis, unless it was bored and wanted someone to play with.

Have you read the book Job: A Comedy of Justice by Robert Heinlein? I think you would enjoy it.
Anonymous Coward
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03/29/2009 09:54 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Actually....the word fear was changed from the true meaning of "reverence, or awe".

We shouldn't ever fear "God"....only be awed by the awesomeness of it all.

I have to disagree! Satan didn't kill a single person in the bible but god kills millions! Be afraid, Be very afraid!


The existence of satan is another thing that makes no sense to me. Mainly because if god created the universe and all that is in it, why would god create a nemisis, unless it was bored and wanted someone to play with.

Have you read the book Job: A Comedy of Justice by Robert Heinlein? I think you would enjoy it.
 Quoting: Sombra

Nope, I will check it out ;{>
Sombra  (OP)

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03/29/2009 10:03 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
I would like to thank you all for your responses to my questions.

Have a good evening.

hf
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 637199
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03/29/2009 10:06 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Actually....the word fear was changed from the true meaning of "reverence, or awe".

We shouldn't ever fear "God"....only be awed by the awesomeness of it all.

I have to disagree! Satan didn't kill a single person in the bible but god kills millions! Be afraid, Be very afraid!


The existence of satan is another thing that makes no sense to me. Mainly because if god created the universe and all that is in it, why would god create a nemisis, unless it was bored and wanted someone to play with.

Have you read the book Job: A Comedy of Justice by Robert Heinlein? I think you would enjoy it.
 Quoting: Sombra


Isaiah 45:7 (King James Version)

7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Wow, this deity is awesome, as far as fictional deities go, which isn't very far at all. Fearing your creator is an insult to the intellect, which is why I consider fear-based religions as another form of mind-control.
Servant
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03/29/2009 10:59 PM
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Re: the Fear of God

Well actually it doesn't.

It's just what you were taught to keep you from questioning!
Have you ever met a small child who doesn't question?? This is how understanding grows and this is what Jesus taught - to become as a little child! There is, however, a difference between questioning to learn and questioning because of doubt. I believe we are expected to want to learn and hence to question.


Sorry, but it does. We read that book from cover to cover and had to write endless essays on it. I read that passage a couple of times myself and we had one class discussion on it that I can remember.

I haven't picked up a Bible since High School, and that was a good 10 years ago. Too bad I threw out my notebooks; my Religion binder would have come in handy many times on GLP. lol

I agree with you in that religious children are taught NOT to think; that's actually why I turned away from Catholicism and Christianity. None of my questions were met with answers that actually made sense.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 517558


Sorry but it doesn't!! If you believe it does then please provide text and quote because I believe VERY strongly that it doesn't!
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2009 07:52 AM
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Re: the Fear of God
My teachers and my church taught me to fear God, in the sense of being afraid of Him. If I let any bad thought into my head or do any bad thing like sin, God will send me to Hell for eternity. Fear in the literal sense, not the figurative sense of "awe" was definitely what was intended. By being mindful of God and his wrath, and fearing it I would avoid doing all the things I was not supposed to do.
Servant
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03/30/2009 10:15 AM
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Re: the Fear of God
My teachers and my church taught me to fear God, in the sense of being afraid of Him. If I let any bad thought into my head or do any bad thing like sin, God will send me to Hell for eternity. Fear in the literal sense, not the figurative sense of "awe" was definitely what was intended. By being mindful of God and his wrath, and fearing it I would avoid doing all the things I was not supposed to do.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 637792


If you live by the sword you will die by the sword! If this is the god they believe in - this is the god they will get! I would want NOTHING to do with such a god! This god is from the very place you fear and feeds off your fear - I renounced this god and all its works and ways years ago and surrendered to Divine Love. This is the God Jesus taught about, this God of divine Love was the one Jesus referred to as Father. If you read the words of Jesus and these words alone, you will discover this God. You too will are able to call him Father for he loves you, you are His child!

I wish you well. hf
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2009 01:14 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
My teachers and my church taught me to fear God, in the sense of being afraid of Him. If I let any bad thought into my head or do any bad thing like sin, God will send me to Hell for eternity. Fear in the literal sense, not the figurative sense of "awe" was definitely what was intended. By being mindful of God and his wrath, and fearing it I would avoid doing all the things I was not supposed to do.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 637792


If you live by the sword you will die by the sword! If this is the god they believe in - this is the god they will get! I would want NOTHING to do with such a god! This god is from the very place you fear and feeds off your fear - I renounced this god and all its works and ways years ago and surrendered to Divine Love. This is the God Jesus taught about, this God of divine Love was the one Jesus referred to as Father. If you read the words of Jesus and these words alone, you will discover this God. You too will are able to call him Father for he loves you, you are His child!

I wish you well. hf
 Quoting: Servant 641541

The true Christian church is the Roman Catholic church and you cannot pick and choose God. They are the experts and this is what they teach.
Sombra  (OP)

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03/30/2009 01:58 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Actually....the word fear was changed from the true meaning of "reverence, or awe".

We shouldn't ever fear "God"....only be awed by the awesomeness of it all.

I have to disagree! Satan didn't kill a single person in the bible but god kills millions! Be afraid, Be very afraid!


The existence of satan is another thing that makes no sense to me. Mainly because if god created the universe and all that is in it, why would god create a nemisis, unless it was bored and wanted someone to play with.

Have you read the book Job: A Comedy of Justice by Robert Heinlein? I think you would enjoy it.


Isaiah 45:7 (King James Version)

7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Wow, this deity is awesome, as far as fictional deities go, which isn't very far at all. Fearing your creator is an insult to the intellect, which is why I consider fear-based religions as another form of mind-control.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 637199


I agree with that. There is only one purpose to fostering fear and that is control.
Sombra  (OP)

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03/30/2009 02:00 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
My teachers and my church taught me to fear God, in the sense of being afraid of Him. If I let any bad thought into my head or do any bad thing like sin, God will send me to Hell for eternity. Fear in the literal sense, not the figurative sense of "awe" was definitely what was intended. By being mindful of God and his wrath, and fearing it I would avoid doing all the things I was not supposed to do.



If you live by the sword you will die by the sword! If this is the god they believe in - this is the god they will get! I would want NOTHING to do with such a god! This god is from the very place you fear and feeds off your fear - I renounced this god and all its works and ways years ago and surrendered to Divine Love. This is the God Jesus taught about, this God of divine Love was the one Jesus referred to as Father. If you read the words of Jesus and these words alone, you will discover this God. You too will are able to call him Father for he loves you, you are His child!

I wish you well. hf

The true Christian church is the Roman Catholic church and you cannot pick and choose God. They are the experts and this is what they teach.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 646155


The Roman Catholic Church is the Roman Empire. Every Pope/Emperor has done some cherry picking on what people should and should not do.
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2009 02:25 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
My teachers and my church taught me to fear God, in the sense of being afraid of Him. If I let any bad thought into my head or do any bad thing like sin, God will send me to Hell for eternity. Fear in the literal sense, not the figurative sense of "awe" was definitely what was intended. By being mindful of God and his wrath, and fearing it I would avoid doing all the things I was not supposed to do.



If you live by the sword you will die by the sword! If this is the god they believe in - this is the god they will get! I would want NOTHING to do with such a god! This god is from the very place you fear and feeds off your fear - I renounced this god and all its works and ways years ago and surrendered to Divine Love. This is the God Jesus taught about, this God of divine Love was the one Jesus referred to as Father. If you read the words of Jesus and these words alone, you will discover this God. You too will are able to call him Father for he loves you, you are His child!

I wish you well. hf

The true Christian church is the Roman Catholic church and you cannot pick and choose God. They are the experts and this is what they teach.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 646155


How are they "experts"?
aonomous beleaver
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03/30/2009 02:38 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
As with most,if not all,aspects concerning god have been passed down through the generations by wrtten text or word of mouth.For the(christen)or beleaver the bible is our guide book or map as it were,to the beginning of understanding concerning our heavenly father.Here we might get some understanding that god is life itself and we and all life are his creation.And here on this earth,where we are,their is some sortive devine plan concerning us.I beleave he gives us much lead way and choice concerning him.For in the end of who,what,where,when and why,it will be our chioce of what we are going to beleave.But we are his children,make no mastake about that!And like any good father he will discipline us,for his reasons and perpouses.It is better to be for him then against him.(faith)pleases god concerning man,faith and trust.Our ways are not his ways and somtimes it canot be understood why things are the way they are.I personally donot want his rod on my ass for any reason.But remember the creater(Our Heavenly Father)has a million ways to be for you and the same amount to be against.
Anonymous Coward
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03/30/2009 05:54 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
As with most,if not all,aspects concerning god have been passed down through the generations by wrtten text or word of mouth.For the(christen)or beleaver the bible is our guide book or map as it were,to the beginning of understanding concerning our heavenly father.Here we might get some understanding that god is life itself and we and all life are his creation.And here on this earth,where we are,their is some sortive devine plan concerning us.I beleave he gives us much lead way and choice concerning him.For in the end of who,what,where,when and why,it will be our chioce of what we are going to beleave.But we are his children,make no mastake about that!And like any good father he will discipline us,for his reasons and perpouses.It is better to be for him then against him.(faith)pleases god concerning man,faith and trust.Our ways are not his ways and somtimes it canot be understood why things are the way they are.I personally donot want his rod on my ass for any reason.But remember the creater(Our Heavenly Father)has a million ways to be for you and the same amount to be against.
 Quoting: aonomous beleaver 603629

True. [link to www.savemenowjesus.com]

And knowing that our creator God has both our life and our death in his holy hands we both love and fear him!
Sombra  (OP)

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03/31/2009 08:45 AM
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Re: the Fear of God
My teachers and my church taught me to fear God, in the sense of being afraid of Him. If I let any bad thought into my head or do any bad thing like sin, God will send me to Hell for eternity. Fear in the literal sense, not the figurative sense of "awe" was definitely what was intended. By being mindful of God and his wrath, and fearing it I would avoid doing all the things I was not supposed to do.



If you live by the sword you will die by the sword! If this is the god they believe in - this is the god they will get! I would want NOTHING to do with such a god! This god is from the very place you fear and feeds off your fear - I renounced this god and all its works and ways years ago and surrendered to Divine Love. This is the God Jesus taught about, this God of divine Love was the one Jesus referred to as Father. If you read the words of Jesus and these words alone, you will discover this God. You too will are able to call him Father for he loves you, you are His child!

I wish you well. hf

The true Christian church is the Roman Catholic church and you cannot pick and choose God. They are the experts and this is what they teach.


How are they "experts"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 633680


Only becasue they claimed it and people allowed it because of not wanting to think or feel for themselves.
Love God
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03/31/2009 05:48 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Actually....the word fear was changed from the true meaning of "reverence, or awe".

We shouldn't ever fear "God"....only be awed by the awesomeness of it all.

I have to disagree! Satan didn't kill a single person in the bible but god kills millions! Be afraid, Be very afraid!
 Quoting: The Antichrist 666

This lie comes from Satan himself. Satan brought death into the world. Satan authored death.

[link to www.savemenowjesus.com]

Jesus brings eternal life. So, even though Satan brought death [and sin] into this world, faith in Jesus brings eternal life. Thus, death loses its 'sting' through the death of Jesus on the cross.
Sombra  (OP)

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03/31/2009 10:46 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Actually....the word fear was changed from the true meaning of "reverence, or awe".

We shouldn't ever fear "God"....only be awed by the awesomeness of it all.

I have to disagree! Satan didn't kill a single person in the bible but god kills millions! Be afraid, Be very afraid!

This lie comes from Satan himself. Satan brought death into the world. Satan authored death.

[link to www.savemenowjesus.com]

Jesus brings eternal life. So, even though Satan brought death [and sin] into this world, faith in Jesus brings eternal life. Thus, death loses its 'sting' through the death of Jesus on the cross.
 Quoting: Love God 642563


That still sounds like the most egocentric tripe ever. "I can do anything I want as long as I proclaim that Jesus died for my sins. I don't have to be responsible for anything, not even having an orignal thought. But anyone who doesn't have faith like mine, even though I don't know what their faith is, will burn in hell."
Anonymous Coward
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03/31/2009 11:07 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
That still sounds like the most egocentric tripe ever. "I can do anything I want as long as I proclaim that Jesus died for my sins. I don't have to be responsible for anything, not even having an orignal thought. But anyone who doesn't have faith like mine, even though I don't know what their faith is, will burn in hell."
 Quoting: Sombra


Agreed. Such a stance is completely illogical, and is an error. It's the product of the herd mentality of the Pharisees. Same shit, different day.
(Jesus did die for our sin, but we're called to repent and walk *away* from our failure, die to self, and be changed. The faith of someone else is between them and God, and God is more than fair in dealing with each of us.)
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 644072
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03/31/2009 11:40 PM
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Re: the Fear of God
Actually....the word fear was changed from the true meaning of "reverence, or awe".

We shouldn't ever fear "God"....only be awed by the awesomeness of it all.

I have to disagree! Satan didn't kill a single person in the bible but god kills millions! Be afraid, Be very afraid!
 Quoting: The Antichrist 666

Satan hasn't created any lives.

God has created all lives.





GLP