--- Do Chemtrails really exist? ---

I see people voting but no comments?

There is no evidence to support "chemtrails". Everything I have seen so far is just ignorant and paranoid speculation.

Could there be people who from time to time spray substances in the sky as party of research? Sure...but that doesn't mean that the visible trails we all see in the "chemtrail" videos we all see on youtube...or the trails we all see in the sky over our houses...are anything more than persistent contrails/contrail cirrus/cirrus uncinus.

Has the sky always looked like this and no one noticed till now?

[link to farm2.static.flickr.com]

What are the odds of that?

They seem to be Zero.

I think that we have much more air traffic than we used to AND people are paying more attention these days especially since 9/11

Like I said my theory is probably correct in that what we think are chemtrails are in fact just water vapor.

I support your theory, I posted the same story many times before here, but chemtrail tards dont want to listen.

In reality it is a little more complicated, because cloud formation happens when there is too much water in the air, which is depended on the temperature of the air. So cloud formation is connected to warm and cold fronts, which are created by any system of high or low pressure.

What I know is the jets come through and the sky is then cloudy.
I've watched it 100's of times.
Here it is right now... Being filled in...
[link to farm7.static.flickr.com]

This happens to Chicago more days than not.

I accept that there is more air traffic,
I do not accept that more air traffic has anything to due with our atmosphere showing what used to be known as a fairly rare phenomena (persistent contrails)- on a Regular basis. Normal contrails that dissipate within a few seconds are becoming the rarity.

Right now- [link to farm7.static.flickr.com]

WHO hasn't noticed until now?! I have seen these trails over the Boston suburbs for 40 years!

The fact that new routes/flights are added all the time could be the reason why some who have never seen the trails have only recently begun to.

Has anyone considered that a persistent CONtrail could happen if climate has changed and cosmic rays increase?

I mean there could be OTHER reasons for increase in persistent contrails than them spraying particulates into the atmosphere.

Did you know air pollution can increase the likelihood of cloud formation and persistence?

Last Edited by Veresanctus on 10/10/2011 10:54 AM

That's quite an interesting one, because it suggests that the very fact that there are more aircraft (and thus more pollution at altitude) is the reason why the contrails are now more plentiful and persistent.

I voted no - I've observed persistent trails all my life and I honestly have no reason to believe these are nothing but contrails, and the resulting contrail cirrus clouds.

Nice to see a thread about trials that hasn't degenerated into mindless insult throwing within the first page though!

That's because no one has yet come to this thread accusing people of being "government shills/agents" for not accepting the circumstantial evidence that suggests "chemtrails" are real, as truth.


That should change any minute now...It always does.

Noble you are the only one who says they have seen persistent trails over Boston for 40 years.

Why is that? Why is it I believe the 35 or so people I know who live there over your one claim?
~Or the 1000's of people I have spoken over the last decade plus whom live all over the earth- I travel a lot. I talk a lot. Your claim is outweighed by the experiences of so many people.

I think you are straight up lying. I think your lying about your age too. Your conversations look to be the work of a 20-something. The mental games you play, like always posting a baiting line demeaning the other person in your posts- that stuff is kids stuff man. Yet you are all about it.
It is possible your social skills are retarded for your age, but I am assuming you simply lied about your age.

Your game will only work on people who are too young to remember 'a real sky'. You can feed them your fake history.

Cheers~

Yeah, you said it yourself, the criss cross pattern implies organization, or an organized application.

Air traffic is just not that organized, that is, even though flights leave and depart on a schedule, the chance of them criss crossing at the same points at different altitudes would be against the odds.

Not to mention that the planes fly at altitudes that would require oxygen masks.

We were trailed just the other day, nice milk white fog left behind instead of blue sky.

IGNORE THE GRID.
THIS IS A NORMAL SKY.
THE SKY HAS ALWAYS LOOKED THIS WAY.
GO BACK TO SLEEP.

[link to farm1.static.flickr.com]

Really, Someone google cognitive dissonance.
Wtf.

"Organized...." By well understood air routes and ATC...

Yes, it IS just that organized!

And aircraft intersect flight paths with each other at ALL altitudes..

Pressurized cabins negate the need for oxygen masks.


Where do you people glean your knowledge about aviation from?! Other people who have never studied the subjects?!

there has to be particulates involved for contrails to persist like we are all seeing in most cases.. be it man-made or natural. naturally the particulates come from saltwater (sodium).. made-made can be from pollution from burning coal and other fossil fuels is one way among many. why are these particulate present on days we see them versus days when they dissipate quickly? tough to say with any certainty.. the last round I witnessed was after a low pressure system had already passed and high pressure system was in control.. so that particular time pokes a whole in the OP's theory.. A lot of fear-based controversy surrounds this subject because folks fear what they don't understand.. I have no proof but just a feeling that they are present to protect us from solar and cosmic rays while the earth's magnetic field (our shield) is weak.. I really doubt that it a world-wide wild conspiracy to battle over-population like some of the theories propose.. if they are introducing particulates to sustain contrails it would be to protect us not kill us off.. these guys are breathing the same air we are..

I guess in short to answer the OP's question "are they just water vapor?" the answer is no.

[link to weather.about.com]

[link to weather.about.com]

The issue was that during days where we are under a very high pressure system there are no VISIBLE contrails but days with lower pressure they then become VISIBLE (obviously there was still air traffic on the high pressure days). INSTEAD of them being visible BECAUSE of particulates (i.e. seeing the particulates not the vapor).

I hope I am making sense lol

Last Edited by Veresanctus on 10/10/2011 11:37 AM

There are different high pressure systems, when I say high I mean very high as well as large and uncommon like we have had over the past several weeks in Arkansas.

I found it interesting that we had ZERO contrails during those weeks that was able to see until the weather changed and pressure dropped. Some may say it's because of the weather change that they are not spraying but others say it's the weather changes themselves that are making the contrails visible.

Last Edited by Veresanctus on 10/10/2011 11:42 AM

The skies NEVER looked like this since I was a child. I am very attentive to my surroundings, always have been. These did not appear until the late 90's...

SO, what do you think has changed then?

[link to www.lightwatcher.com]

10 million people, 500 square miles of Chicagoland in 4 hours. Not bad for a half day's work.

'Intelligent' business associates who think parallel rows of clouds in a criss-cross formation is so strange they take IPhone pics of them. Even when told a 767 sprayed them, they have 'more important' things to think about.

Adds up to... spray at their hearts content, complacent populace below.

Proof is found each time in the GOES East satellite image archive, until that's scrubbed.

LowRes for GLP

Last Edited by uscrusader1 on 10/10/2011 12:04 PM

Veresanctus-

Curious if you have seen
'What in the World are they Spraying'

for the past four weeks I've been working on a mountain top in western Maine where we (me and my employees) had ample view of air traffic and the sky in 360 degree. We actually tried to pay attention to the issue throughout the days working there.. there has been on-going conversation about it for over a year or more as we are outside all the time.. what was funny was on this day (last friday) it was waay too obvious and it surely seemed like they were trying to shield the earth from above when about mid-day there was only one section of the sky left blue.. I mentioned to the guys that there was only a small area left uncovered and that they were slacking..LOL.. sure enough ten minutes later two planes went thru it and sealed the deal.. "operation sunscreen" was complete .. mission accomplished.. the humor of it pretty much slipped away after a fashion and we began to discuss why.. the air traffic that day was at least 5 times more than other days.. we were paying attention to this the whole time up there.. at that point it became more or less obvious that it was indeed happening and the new focus was why..

to your credit though OP.. there is no way that we could sample the moisture saturation levels up there so it's still only speculation.. was there a super-saturation condition? couldn't tell ya one way or the other.. did make for a really interesting day though.

And vice versa.
In 2009 to mask the joint DHS/Air Force terrorist flight interdiction excercises over Chicago, the chemtrails were used to create a fog/cloud cover. The usual grid pattern was used.
Thread: Chem Trails in Chicagoland

The fog didn't mask the sounds of screaming F16's however, atypical over Chicago airspace.

Two-R-One,
It's not like their slapping on a coat of wall paint in every direction.

I'm very impressed with the engineering! GPS controlled parallel line grid pattern, precisely 8 miles apart(Chicago), which mists down to a perfect 'even' coverage within hours. And yes, the occasional 'touch-up', all with the same aircraft.

I just took this today:

[link to i56.tinypic.com]

Yes and other videos, and they are convincing

Wow! images of contrail cirrus! Yup, that's proof that contrail cirrus are made by airplanes...

Yes, they are meant to be convincing...they are a recruitment tool.

Too bad not a SINGLE atmospheric scientist or geologist was consulted for that "documentary" (farce) known as "What in the World are they Spraying"...why?! Because the people who made it believe all those people are in on it!