Misandry -Why Men Don't Exist

Have you not read the innumerable foul mouthed, hostile and childishly insulting posts from SandiT?

Or should I just assume you save up all your appeals for clear communications and the avoidance of emotional projection for the men who have the gall to challenge your religion?

real men light fires
they don't give a damn
about women
yelling at them to stop
or neutered men
bleatingly demanding 'points'
be a man
live your life

Last Edited by OpenHeartMonk on 01/30/2012 12:02 AM

Real men are not afraid to stand up against injustice.

I have to say I have answered Sivaro's question, I also have asked a few questions of my own that have never been answered.

This thread is getting a little out of hand. The whole header is easily misinterpreted. Misandry does exist. It is a hatred of men. Personally I don't hate men, I dislike quite a few of them, but I dislike quite a few women as well.

Misandry has been around since the beginning of time, it was just given a name around 1909. As far as the video saying that it was just recently been put in the dictionary.... well there are a lot of words that have been around forever that still aren't in there.

I too could make a video of just the opposite of that one portraying women as never mentioned. Just because the word MAN is not inserted does not mean they are being overlooked. Some of the clips in the video were pre- feminist movement, so you can not blame the feminist movement on the fact that the word men are not mentioned.

Men are an important part of our world! So are women. How many holidays do we have celebrating women over men? I'm not complaining. If you are doing this thread merely to have people give you validation for existence, than I think you perhaps have some deeper issues that you constantly need reassurance and ego stroking.

There are many great men inventors and scientists that are honored today. There are also a few women... if they were not allowed to do so called feminist movement things, than I guess some things would not be invented, because that is "just not a woman's thing".

There's nothing unclear about my communication, old chap.

And as far as childish and insulting, that's hilarious. You're a real comedian trying to call anyone else childish and insulting.

You try for a "high class" kind of delicious condescension, but you just come off as a pompous low rent prick trying to look high on the hog.

You're pathetic at it.


Let's all look at your pedantic attempts to be sly and "mature" about your childish insults...



Yeah. You're a real upstanding guy. Nothing intentionally insulting in this one. No snideness, no sarcasm, no flippancy here...

Okay, the post is rife with your childishness. But hey, at least it's "mature" childishness.

You're not only intellectually dishonest, but you're emotionally dishonest, as well. You vaunt yourself as mature, yet reading your drivel shows a penchant for pedantic condescension.

I don't even need to bold anything, your posts drip with your infantile pretense of superiority and your pathetic attempts at snobbery.

Let's all take a look at a few examples of your "mature" attitude. Because we all know that as long as you don't SWEAR, you're being "mature".

I don't think the men on this thread are looking for validation. They are speaking out against a corrossive and pervasive anti-male attitude in our society. You have admitted that this attitude exists.

But do you think the average person on the street is aware that this attitude exists? How many times have you seen a man being kicked in the crotch presented as a hilarious, rip snorting joke in movies or television?

Have you ever heard anyone object to it?

Would you find it offensive if women were shown being kicked in the crotch while people roar with laughter?

Would you be uncomfortable with an all-male TV panel laughing and joking about a woman whose vagina had been sliced with razor blades?

There seems to be this idea women have that if men object to this kind of man-bashing in society that somehow, by some weird extension, we are advocating for more hatred of women.

Stop and think about how irrational that is.

If I say, "I find it offensive when my race is called (insert ethnic slur)", do you then automatically say, "Well, some people call Mexicans (insert ethnic slur! Why do you hate Mexicans?"

Just try, I mean really try, to understand how frustrating that is. To have any discussion hijacked by people who accuse you of misogyny because you are pointing out unfairness for males that you have already admitted exists.

No one is denying that misogyny exists. Several posters have already said so several times. But right now we are not talking about women--not everything in the world is about women!

Don't you think that attitudes and assumptions are being shaped by the incessant man-bashing? Is that the world you want to create for your sons?

There is already a veritable avalanche of attention being poured out for women's issues. VAWA, breast cancer awareness, on and on and on it goes. Magazine articles, books, talk shows.

It's not as if women and their problems are being ignored in this culture.

So maybe we can take five minutes to talk about issues that affect men and only men without being tarred with the tired old 'woman hater' brush in an attempt to stifle the conversation.

lol I have no religion. Projection again, that I am invested in a certain way of thinking/being that relates to feminism.

No, I did not read every one of Sandi's posts. I did read the most recent one. And while it did have some very good points, there was a noticeable hostile tone. She did say herself that she did not care to engage in certain civilities quote unquote.

To my perspective, whatever its origins, feminism has been a boon to women and their ability to choose a freer life. As I mentioned a few pages back, my great grandmother died of malnutrition while in childbirth because she was married to an abusive, alcoholic man who locked up the cupboards when he took off to work as an itinerant farmer in Ireland. I am very thankful that there has been a 'revolution in consciousness' since then, so that I have been able to choose where I work, with whom I relate, how to live my life etc.

I willingly support a men's movement that will liberate men from the abuses they suffer in this society that we live in. Boys are socialized from a very young age to shut down their emotions. One of the few acceptable emotions that a man can express seems to be anger. This is physically damaging to a man, but also damaging to women, children, and nations (through war.)
A lot of men do have the short end of the stick regarding divorce settlements and custody etc. But men need to organize themselves and start raising awareness about these issues. (This is similar to the journey that women took, organizing themselves to be recognized as ful class citizens able to vote, etc.) No one else is going to do it for you.

I do agree with Sandi that this thread is disingenious. Misandry is quite a different topic of discussion than 'bashing feminism'. Men can be positive about themselves, share information and organize, without putting down women, or a movement that most women would agree has helped women.

Men will need to organize themselves and change this perspective in society at large. Through this journey, men will evolve and change....and future men will reap the benefits. Just like I am reaping the benefits of women who organized many years ago.
What you write above is also different from what a lot of this thread has been about. There has been much feminish-bashing and women-hating going on.
If you could focus on issues that affect men and only men, without putting down women or feminism, that would be a breath of fresh air indeed.

You cannot legislate an attitude.

I'm not interested in passing laws. I'm not interested in appealing to the government to stop man bashing.

Attitudes can only be changed by people realizing that they are RIGHT.

And the only way to change attitudes is to lead by example.

I understand what you are saying completely. I also understand that feminism can not be blamed for this. I don't anywhere see where any of it fits together. That was my point.

There are some things that I find funny in comic situations, and others I do not. Let's admit it, people make fun of everyone including your "Momma". It doesn't make them not exist in life or diminish their worth.

BTW breast cancer is not just a woman's issue, and I hate the color pink I don't sport the ribbon anywhere. Nor do I advocate it. I think more men's problems would be thrown out there like that if men took the time to promote it as well.

I do think blonde jokes are funny even though I am a blonde, because I KNOW they are jokes. I don't classify myself as the dumb blonde.... well not 100% of the time anyway, I think we all have our DUH moments.

Thanks for responding, without yelling or putting me down. It was much appreciated.

You can have all the time you want, when you actually want to talk about misandry, without trying to strap it onto the chest of women's rights.

I don't see any of you actually talking about it, though. Not really. I've talked more about it than you have.

Where's all the discussion about why it's important that fathers get better hearing in courts?

I see teschen jumped into the thread not to discuss misandry, but to make idiotic claims about how stupid women are.

If you really wanted to talk about it, and more importantly if OP wanted to, then you'd TALK ABOUT IT. But instead, you want to talk about how it's women's fault. How women gaining the right to own themselves somehow stole the whole world from men.

I've already pointed out that the problem with the premise posted that "there are no 'men' in the media" with the fact that it's in large part because men are treated as individuals. Ron Paul is just Ron Paul. Mitt Romney is just Mitt Romney.

If you want to talk about men's issues, then do it without the smear campaign against women's rights.

If any of you even can, since the large majority of you seem to nonstop blame everything on women anyway.

So, you have just compared marrying your son to a feminist.

To marrying my daughter to a Muslim.


You are quite aware that I would not want my daughter to marry a Muslim. Yet despite your claim that you would want your son to marry a feminist, you still make the correlation between the Son/Feminist to Daughter/Muslin

How interesting. I guess you answered the question as to Motherly instinct to Selfish desire question I originally posed.

Feminism is the root cause of Misandry. Misandry is a nail in the coffin of any Nation. Feminism = Misandry

Feminine + Masculine = success. Feminist and Men beaten down = failure.

The majority of what you call 'feminist bashing' is a result of feminists hijacking the thread with accusations that men are lazy, evil misogynists.

How do you think the average person is going to react to that kind of approach? Do you think it will make people very eager to hear more from people who make sexist, hateful accusations they apply to an entire gender?

And why must men organize? Are women unable to exercise their own agency to eradicate an obvious social evil? Will women sit on the sidelines, admitting on one hand that complaints of misandry are justified while insisting that men can damn well do all the heavy lifting themselves?

That doesn't say much for the female sense of morality or ideas about social justice.

Well, exactly.
Writing threads is not going to change anything.(Except to start to help you on your journey.)
Action and organizing bodies on the ground, is what will change prevailing attitudes.
An attitudinal change in consciousness will come after that. And then laws (which is supposed to be 'the government') will be enacted which reflect that change in societal attitude.

Have you ever seen Amos 'n Andy? Or those old cartoons featuring an Aunt Jemima sort of black woman character?

Or how about the Bugs Bunny shorts made during World war II? The ones with ridiculous caricatures of Hirohito and the Japanese?

Probably you have not, because they are deemed inappropriate and extremely offensive by todays standards.

Humor reveals a lot about a people. The things they laugh about says something about the attitudes that prevail.

I would really like you to answer this question: Would you be offended by an all male panel laughing and joking about a woman whose vagina had been slashed by razor blades. Yes or no, please.

Do you see how "Yo momma" and dumb blonde jokes cannot be compared to this?

This is simply not true: The majority of what you call 'feminist bashing' is a result of feminists hijacking the thread with accusations that men are lazy, evil misogynists. It is so obviously false, I am surprized that you thought to try it.
Why must men organize? Because they are the ones affected by this. Why do people of colour organize so that they are not ignored or discriminated against? Why did women have to organize themselves to be able to vote? If this issues bothers enough men, they will organize themselves to change it. Nothing is ever 'handed' to you. You have to organize, educate and fight to change prevailing societal attitudes. That is the way it works.
as well.

Brandi:

I actually do not see this as far off as you think . I have not correlated feminism with = Rights. You have been backed onto that corner by the excellent posters on this thread.

Your only answer now is to claim that all these men and myself, want and desire women to be in bondage to men. What you are really saying is that WE are Misogynist.

My views on feminist are different than yours, In my world I see Feminist as man haters, that cry for special privilege's and not equality. This behavior having been allowed has cause a huge schism in society. As Feminist gained ground, Men have consistently been treated worse in the media and in the courts.

There is a direct correlation to the rise of Feminism to the result of Misandry.

You are busy defending a position nobody is attacking. Being considered a Human being is a right of all men and women. This is not the case today, as has been pointed out in this thread.

Last Edited by Sivaro on 01/30/2012 12:48 AM

And it showed you how totally absurd your point was. You tried to make it out like marrying a feminist is some kind of horrible thing.

Now you see exactly how absurd you sounded. Good on you, you're not completely hopeless!



I AM quite aware of it. What you aren't aware of, is how ironic that is. You want the very life for her that she would have. You want her rights gone...

But when faced with the REALITY of what that represents, you are outraged I would even suggest it. It should be obvious...

That's what you tried to do with "would you want your son to marry a feminist". You TRIED to make it out sound like "obviously no one would". But you failed.

I, on the other hand, succeeded. And I made my point extremely well.



Actually, I pointed out how absurd and stupid it was that you tried to make feminists out to be some kind of monsters that no one would want to marry, or have their sons married to.

I pointed out the absurdity of your insinuated assertion, and now you are trying to twist it around into some kind of weird "you have no motherly instincts" or some such twaddle.



You are wrong. Feminism is about the right of the woman to own herself. To be able to make choices and live without being an enforced dependent for her entire life.

You instinctively KNOW that a life where she is a slave and a non-person is evil. This is why you recoil immediately at the very IDEA of marrying your daughter into such a marriage where she is property and has no rights.

It's wrong, and you know it's wrong. But you don't care that you instinctively know it's wrong. What you do care about is that you exalt your belief that "feminism is the cause of misandry".

You are perfectly happy with the idea of a society in which women are considered stupid. You are pleased at the idea of a society in which women are not allowed to voice their opinions.

In such a society, you believe, if misandry is not voiced by women, it does not exist. But because you have stolen the first amendment rights of women to VOICE their misery, and the fact that the men who own, control, and consider them stupid are harming them... does not take away that harm.

If you didn't know this already, you would be very pleased to sell your daughter into such a "traditional" life.



Unfortunately, your idea of "feminine + masculine" is "slave + master"... provided that you can have a slave of your own but not have to make your daughter into one, too!

Yes, I have seen them (Cartoons), and yes I would be offended just as I would if something that horrific was being joked about a man. It's an uncalled for act.

Man hating is not feminism, you twit.

Once more, it has been saddled to it, in order to get stupid people to fight against FEMINISM.

Feminism:

1.
the doctrine advocating social, political, and all other rights of women equal to those of men.
2.
( sometimes initial capital letter ) an organized movement for the attainment of such rights for women.



If you are going to make up your own meanings for words, then you are going to be misunderstood. Stop hiding behind "nobody wants to take away women's rights" when you purposefully posted IN YOUR OPENING POST that FEMINISM is the destroyer of nations.

You knew when you wrote it that you weren't talking about man haters. You were talking about the movement intended to establish EQUAL RIGHTS for men and women.

The statement you open this thread with is that when women get rights, it "destroys" nations.

Now you are just outright lying to try to cover up for it, having been caught with your hand straight in the honey pot.



And furthermore, you KNOW that you are being disingenuous... and outright lying....


""There is a direct correlation to the rise of Feminism to the result of Misandry.""

So by your retarded and dishonest claim that you see 'feminism' as man-hate, your statement here is absurd:

""There is a direct correlation to the rise of man-hate to the result of man-hate.""

Are you really that big of an idiot?

Last Edited by Sandi_T on 01/30/2012 12:56 AM

You can blame the Zionist Marxist jewish people for misandry and Western society's downfall. Keep in mind that men in OTHER cultures aren't as brainwashed as Western ones are. The Marxist jewish people brainwashed Western men in order to weaken them. Of course men from other cultures are not as subservient.

Excuse me, that is true. You may deny it if you please, but I happen to live inside my own head and know what motivates my thinking far better than an anonymous stranger on the Internet.

Furthermore, if you are interested in what is right what do you care if some men dislike feminists and say so? Does an evil cease being evil because some people happen to not exhibit the attitudes you want to see? Should we all start saying ni**er again because rappers do?

I abhor certain behaviours because I find them morally offensive, not because everyone in the world agrees that my ideas about race are sound.

Once again, I do not see the point of organizing because I am not interested in the government creating new legislation. that's just a band aid on the real problem: social acceptance of flagrant sexism. The only way to change that is to get people to see it for what it is.

The government only makes things worse when it tries its hand at social engineering.

Your circular logic is astounding.

You admit that indeed you were making a point that your idea of marry a daughter to a Muslim is the same as marrying your son to a Feminist.

Yet I agree I would not marry my daughter, and you still want your son to marry a feminist.... DESPITE making the direct and admitted correlation between the TWO possibilities mentioned.

Unbelievable

As for the slave daughter thing, Show one post of mine thats makes me out to be the monster that wants s to keep women barefoot and pregnant. Your thoughts are flights of fancy that shown a very good imagination. Despite having nothing to show to the contrary, you have based your decisions on " feelings" and not proof about me and others in this thread.

Careful, You are showing My version of Feminism clearer and clearer with every post. Better slow down and take a deep breath.

Last Edited by Sivaro on 01/30/2012 01:20 AM

But that's exactly what was done on The View. On national television. And nothing was done about it.

Now, if you were a man, what do you think that would imply to you about your actual status in this society?

While misogyny exists, there are heavy punishments exacted on those who express it publicly. People who said something like that would be ruined, their careers destroyed, their reputation destroyed, their name a by-word for all that is dark and unacceptable.

But women can make these jokes on national TV and......well, nothing.

I can't understand how women don't see that they must start speaking out against this kind of thing. Men are noty taken seriously when they complain; they are screamed at as women-haters, they are derided as sissies, they are mocked and shouted down.

If something is wrong it is the responsibility of DECENT PEOPLE to speak out against it.

The thundering silence from the women in this country is transmitting a message loud and clear to your fathers, brothers, lovers and sons.

You lack reading comprehension. I showed you that I understood what you were trying to do. You were trying to make feminists out to be some kind of monstrous horror.

I reflected that back to you and DISAGREED quite clearly with your claim that it was equal or alike in any way.

It is NOT a common sentiment that "I wouldn't want my son to marry a feminist" in the same way that "I wouldn't sell my daughter to a muslim to marry so she can have a 'traditional' marriage" is universally shocking.

I pointed out how you TRIED FOR IT, and FAILED.

But the more you write, the more I can see how that was too hard for you to grasp. You're the one that thinks that man-hate is the precursor to man-hate.

Sorry I used too sophisticated a method for you to grasp.



Your opening post makes it very clear. FEMINISM is about equal rights, and you want it abolished. This entire thread isn't about MISANDRY at all. It's about the abolishment of FEMINISM so that "misandry" will magically go away.



Well, only you can tell, since you made up a "version" of a word. So anyone can "live up to it" if you dislike them, since it's your own made-up version to begin with.

lol, yes it did seem to exist inside your head, because I certainly could not find many examples going through this thread.
Of course, I disagree with labelling feminism 'evil'. But again, that is a different topic of discussion than misandry.
"The only way to change that is to get people to see it for what it is." This will entail educating people in society....which is organizing. Organizing does not mean that you have to have an end goal of changing legistlation. Organizing can happen from the desire to affect societal change....which is what you seem to want to do.

This statement is not true. When have men spoken out? When have they organized and educated people about this sexist attitude in the media?

Jebus!

Ever get the feeling that American men will accept Islam willingly, just to regain control of us (their women)?

On the one hand, I don't know the incident, so I can't speak to it.

On the other hand, please stop with the "men don't do that" business. Men talk about women in crass, disgusting, foul ways all the time.

Why is it so hard to focus on the problem of misandry without the lying claims that men are so flawless?

You're very hung up on this one incident. Maybe it was all so terrible, but honestly, I think you've taken it up as some kind of symbol.

Making fun of a mutilated genital is terrible. However, there are truly TERRIBLE things happening that are far more important.

Men losing their children is a far more important issue to be focused on. The bias of courts not towards a level and interested involvement in the best interest of all involved, but towards the mother, is a real and profound issue. One that effects all of us, but children especially. That most men are automatically considered less worthy simply by their gender is an actual MEN'S RIGHTS ISSUE.

Coarse discussion of the genitals of the other side has been a staple of men for years. You even used 'vagina' [aka pussy] as a derogatory denigration in your own post.

Where is your real outrage about the genuine issues?

I should have paid attention to the poster that claimed you are like a religious Zealot.

Do you deny that With the rise of Feminism came a rise in Misandry?

Feminism is not about = rights. That is a feel good phrase, like " We all bleed red" or "If it feels good do it" Of COURSE feminist will insist that they just want = rights,

Yet they ARE NOT equal.

Brandi: On average, are men stronger that women?

Do women as a whole have less IQ points then men?

Can men have babies?



The answer is obvious. Yet you insist Feminism is the advancement of = rights for two genders that are different. Your argument SOUNDS good, But only to teenagers and other women.

Simply put, REALITY is different than your textbook definitions. With the rise of Feminism there is a rise in Misandry. There is a correlation. They are related.

Men, have been lowered to a level of barbarians, and non Human by the media and the majority of women. This is a fact. This is not a debate between dictionary definitions but an attempt by myself to raise awareness in other men to how we are being portrayed and treated.

And to take appropriate steps to combat it.