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Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel

 
Achduke7

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06/24/2018 09:46 AM

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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Gospel of Salvation is in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, let us spread the good news in meekness and humility to the lost.

1. Jesus died on the cross
2. For our sins
3. Jesus was buried
4. Jesus rose again
5. All of this is according to the Scriptures, the Holy Bible
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75409848


Except this is the same Gospel as told by the other Apostles also. It is not unique to Paul. Paul wraps it up in one tidy letter but the Apostles told everyone the same thing. There is one Gospel.
Achduke
Juju
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06/24/2018 10:28 AM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Gospel of Salvation is in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, let us spread the good news in meekness and humility to the lost.

1. Jesus died on the cross
2. For our sins
3. Jesus was buried
4. Jesus rose again
5. All of this is according to the Scriptures, the Holy Bible
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75409848


Except this is the same Gospel as told by the other Apostles also. It is not unique to Paul. Paul wraps it up in one tidy letter but the Apostles told everyone the same thing. There is one Gospel.
 Quoting: Achduke7


Ba-bu-but he's got a white board and is wearing a tie.
Anonymous Coward
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06/24/2018 10:39 AM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
The guy in OPs video is a yutz. He puts entirely too much stock in false doctrines.

If he'd ever actually READ the Bible instead of cherry-picking bits of scripture to take them out of context, he'd learn that what he's been teaching all these years in his videos is total bunk.
TheLordsServant

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06/24/2018 10:43 AM

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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Look, pre-trib folks have their hearts in the right place but have adopted a doctrine that is abiblical...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72341210


In your opinion.

I disagree.

Why does that bother you so much?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76699255


What Jesus says doesn't look like pre-trib.

This is just before the 1000 years or at the end of it.

Matthew 13:37-43

37 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.
41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

I am but a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Anonymous Coward
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06/24/2018 03:59 PM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Hours later...no Bible verses on a Pre-Tribulation Rapture. Hmmm. What do you know? Maybe because they don't exist!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72341210


1 Thess:4

13 I would not brethren, have you ignorant concerning they which are asleep, that ye sorrow not even as others which have no hope.14 For if we believe that Jesus is dead, and is risen, even so them which sleep in Jesus, will God bring with him.15 For this say we unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which live, and are remaining in the coming of the Lord, shall not prevent them which sleep.16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, and with the voice of the Archangel, and with the trumpet of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:17 Then shall we which live and remain, be caught up with them also in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.18 Wherefore, comfort yourselves one another with these words.

2 Thess:2

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our assembling unto him,2 That ye be not suddenly moved from your mind, nor troubled neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter, as it were from us, as though the day of Christ were at hand.3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a departing first, and that [h]that man of sin be disclosed, even the son of perdition.4 Which is an adversary, and exalteth himself against all that is called God, or that is worshipped: so that he doth sit as God in the Temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

1 Corinthians 15:51

Behold, I show you a secret thing, We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet: for the trumpet shall blow, and the dead shall be raised up incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76250665

Nothing in these verses say this happens before the Tribulation.

But...Matthew 24 tells us immediate after the Tribulation and discusses the Rapture.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72341210

Mathew 24 is to the priesthood...the gospel of grace and rapture is ENTIRELY a Pauline doctrine and the priesthood has been blinded to this concept... you are very deceived.
Anonymous Coward
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06/24/2018 04:02 PM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Gospel of Salvation is in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, let us spread the good news in meekness and humility to the lost.

1. Jesus died on the cross
2. For our sins
3. Jesus was buried
4. Jesus rose again
5. All of this is according to the Scriptures, the Holy Bible
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75409848


Except this is the same Gospel as told by the other Apostles also. It is not unique to Paul. Paul wraps it up in one tidy letter but the Apostles told everyone the same thing. There is one Gospel.
 Quoting: Achduke7


absolutely NOT true... what Paul preaches is a completely different doctrine to a completely different group of people... the body is NOT under law, temple worship or animal sacrifices, all of which come back during the final 7 years...
Anonymous Coward
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06/24/2018 04:04 PM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
You say Paul is False,

but You are True,

RIGHT?
Anonymous Coward
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06/24/2018 04:05 PM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Paul really shouldn't be in the Bible

but evil Paul men

defeated the Will of God in the Word of God,

RIGHT?
Achduke7

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06/24/2018 07:24 PM

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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Gospel of Salvation is in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, let us spread the good news in meekness and humility to the lost.

1. Jesus died on the cross
2. For our sins
3. Jesus was buried
4. Jesus rose again
5. All of this is according to the Scriptures, the Holy Bible
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75409848


Except this is the same Gospel as told by the other Apostles also. It is not unique to Paul. Paul wraps it up in one tidy letter but the Apostles told everyone the same thing. There is one Gospel.
 Quoting: Achduke7


absolutely NOT true... what Paul preaches is a completely different doctrine to a completely different group of people... the body is NOT under law, temple worship or animal sacrifices, all of which come back during the final 7 years...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76250665



1 Corinthians 15:1-4 1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:





lets see...


Luke 24:46-47 46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Matthew 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Luke 9:22 Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day.

John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Matthew 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.


Looks like the same gospel to me. Did you see how Christ said to preach it to all nations in Luke 24. Those would be the Gentiles and the Jevvs.


Last Edited by Achduke7 on 06/24/2018 07:25 PM
Achduke
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06/24/2018 08:47 PM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Gospel of Salvation is in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, let us spread the good news in meekness and humility to the lost.

1. Jesus died on the cross
2. For our sins
3. Jesus was buried
4. Jesus rose again
5. All of this is according to the Scriptures, the Holy Bible
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75409848


Except this is the same Gospel as told by the other Apostles also. It is not unique to Paul. Paul wraps it up in one tidy letter but the Apostles told everyone the same thing. There is one Gospel.
 Quoting: Achduke7


absolutely NOT true... what Paul preaches is a completely different doctrine to a completely different group of people... the body is NOT under law, temple worship or animal sacrifices, all of which come back during the final 7 years...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76250665



1 Corinthians 15:1-4 1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:





lets see...


Luke 24:46-47 46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Matthew 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Luke 9:22 Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day.

John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Matthew 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.


Looks like the same gospel to me. Did you see how Christ said to preach it to all nations in Luke 24. Those would be the Gentiles and the Jevvs.

 Quoting: Achduke7


all priesthood...nothing about salvation through faith alone, the priesthood had works, temple worship, they had to keep all the festivals and were under LAW not grace...nowhere did Christ tell the Jevvs they where saved through faith alone... not even during his 40 on earth after resurrection. Peter was looking for tribulation, not rapture, as was Paul. Peter was still going to temple, Paul preached we ARE the temple

2Peter3:15 "15 And suppose that the long suffering of our Lord is salvation,even as our beloved brother Paul according to the wisdom given unto him wrote to you.
16 As one that in all his Epistles speaketh of these things: among the which, some things are hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable, wrest, as they do also other Scriptures unto their own destruction.

Why would Pauls doctrine be hard for Peter to understand...because it was different...
Anonymous Coward
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06/24/2018 08:56 PM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
And still no verses nearly a day later supporting the kooky ideasthat Christians will be raptured before the Tribulation.

Rather, Christians have suffered tribulation throughout history and from inception to present day.
Anonymous Coward
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06/24/2018 09:00 PM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
What did Jesus say. Listen to him!

6Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. 17But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues; 18And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles. 19But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak. 20For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

21And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death. 22And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

23But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

24The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord. 25It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?
Matthew 10:6-24

To the end...which is immediately after the Tribulation when we are raptured home.
freedomsnotfree1

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06/24/2018 09:12 PM
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
What did Jesus say. Listen to him!

6Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. 17But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues; 18And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles. 19But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak. 20For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

21And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death. 22And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

23But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

24The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord. 25It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?
Matthew 10:6-24

To the end...which is immediately after the Tribulation when we are raptured home.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72341210


Who was Jesus speaking to... the priesthood
freedomsnotfree1
Achduke7

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06/24/2018 09:13 PM

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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
...


Except this is the same Gospel as told by the other Apostles also. It is not unique to Paul. Paul wraps it up in one tidy letter but the Apostles told everyone the same thing. There is one Gospel.
 Quoting: Achduke7


absolutely NOT true... what Paul preaches is a completely different doctrine to a completely different group of people... the body is NOT under law, temple worship or animal sacrifices, all of which come back during the final 7 years...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76250665



1 Corinthians 15:1-4 1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:





lets see...


Luke 24:46-47 46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Matthew 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Luke 9:22 Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day.

John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

Matthew 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.


Looks like the same gospel to me. Did you see how Christ said to preach it to all nations in Luke 24. Those would be the Gentiles and the Jevvs.

 Quoting: Achduke7


all priesthood...nothing about salvation through faith alone, the priesthood had works, temple worship, they had to keep all the festivals and were under LAW not grace...nowhere did Christ tell the Jevvs they where saved through faith alone... not even during his 40 on earth after resurrection. Peter was looking for tribulation, not rapture, as was Paul. Peter was still going to temple, Paul preached we ARE the temple

2Peter3:15 "15 And suppose that the long suffering of our Lord is salvation,even as our beloved brother Paul according to the wisdom given unto him wrote to you.
16 As one that in all his Epistles speaketh of these things: among the which, some things are hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable, wrest, as they do also other Scriptures unto their own destruction.

Why would Pauls doctrine be hard for Peter to understand...because it was different...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76250665


John 3:16 is salvation from faith. The apostles are not the levite priests. Still what is the problem if a priest or Christian does works. It does not save them because they are already saved. Christians produce good fruit(works). We are not to be lazy and sit around. Paul still attended temple and even talked about leaving the gentiles to go back for the feasts. Peter was expecting tribulation because the pre-trib rapture is false. Peter also preached we are the temple.

1 Peter 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Peter said that Paul's content in his letters are hard to understand. He did not say his gospel was different. Peter said the unlearned would and are now twisting Paul's words to their own destruction.

2 Peter 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.


There is only one gospel.

Last Edited by Achduke7 on 06/24/2018 09:32 PM
Achduke
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Nope. Jesus spoke to all. In fact, the "priesthood" in his day were scoundrels who placed their interpretation above Torah! That is why he condemns them!

And you are elevating who Jesus made low!

What cherry-pickin'! Imagine combing through the Word and say, "Nope this is not for me but some obscure people who were called antichrists by Jesus."
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Let's look at your kooky logic. Does it hold up? NOPE. If it did then only this priesthood you claim he's talking about are persecuted. Instead, Christians were persecuted by SAUL and they were driven out of the synagogues.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Mark 13
32But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.

33Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is. 34For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch. 35Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning: 36Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping. 37And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.
ÀLL means ALL...not the priesthood.
Anonymous Coward
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Wait for it. Some irrasible intransigent pre-tribber heretic will say, "it means all the priesthood!"

No, you hopeless person squiting at gnats and swallowing camels, it means EVERBODY.
Achduke7

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06/25/2018 08:16 PM

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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Wait for it. Some irrasible intransigent pre-tribber heretic will say, "it means all the priesthood!"

No, you hopeless person squiting at gnats and swallowing camels, it means EVERBODY.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72341210


Not the Tribulation Gospel. Just the Gospel(Good News).
Achduke
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
24 more hours pass without a shred evidence from Scripture about Rapture before Tribulation..

You are abjectly failing.
Anonymous Coward
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06/25/2018 08:22 PM
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Sigh
Achduke7

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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
24 more hours pass without a shred evidence from Scripture about Rapture before Tribulation..

You are abjectly failing.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72341210


There is always a lot of opinion and speculation for a pre-trib rapture. It is just short of actual evidence and scripture.
Achduke
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
I don't know when you got saved, but I got saved when I was a kid...a very young kid who practically on my own intuited that Jesus is absolutely my Lord and Savior.

Nobody is even close to his magnificent kindness, mercy, bravery, and leadership.

And I was taught every day you study the Bible. And now many many decades later, having done that earnestly, you can recollect passages.

Why can't you? Do you read your Bible? Does it thrill you every time?

If you are following some doctrine of men, then you don't need Biblical proof. I do because the whole point is the Bible is full of wisdom and proof.
Achduke7

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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
I don't know when you got saved, but I got saved when I was a kid...a very young kid who practically on my own intuited that Jesus is absolutely my Lord and Savior.

Nobody is even close to his magnificent kindness, mercy, bravery, and leadership.

And I was taught every day you study the Bible. And now many many decades later, having done that earnestly, you can recollect passages.

Why can't you? Do you read your Bible? Does it thrill you every time?

If you are following some doctrine of men, then you don't need Biblical proof. I do because the whole point is the Bible is full of wisdom and proof.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 72341210


AC210,

You need to quote the posts you are referring to so we know who you are talking to.
Achduke
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Jesus preached Christians would suffer persecution and if they lived, go through the Tribulation, then rapture them, then God pours out wrath On everybody else.

His disciples preached the same thing.

The Early Church Fathers, taught by the disciples, taught the very same thing.

This goes on until the eighteenth century when a kooky girl has a vision. Some preachers jump on that and start a new doctrine. It goes nowhere until Jewish people financially support Schofield's Bible translation. This is filled with this doctrine in the footnotes.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
Cui bono (Who benefits?)
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
There's not a "Tribulation Gospel" The GOOD NEWS is that by Jesus being born into this world, dying on the cross and raising from the dead, there's hope for everyone who believes in HIM.

I happen to hold the opinion that not everyone who says they believe actually do.

Jesus said many will say "Lord, Lord," but he will say, "I never knew you."

It's all about a living relationship with and in Christ.

Seeking, knocking and asking.

Tribulation is all about the last days, and will happen, is happening, and has happened.
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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel
I don't agree with this guy. He's saying that an angel brought a different gospel. The term "everlasting gospel" just refers to the fact that Christ's sacrifice was once, for all, and everlasting. Paul simply said that if he, an angel, or anyone else preached something different. he should be accursed.

I don't worry too much about tribulation timelines, given that each of us is mortal, and our own deaths are the ultimate revelation for each of us. Christians have been dying for centuries not seeing the last days events, yet they have gone on to either be with God or not. The rapture itself could be viewed as a very rapid group death, resurrection, and ascension event, assuming that it exists.

Yashua shed his blood once and for all for the remission of sins, and He said, "It is finished.". The price has been paid. Now we simply appropriate the gift through faith and repentance.
 Quoting: Berf Snurple


Scripture is saying that an angel WILL bring a different Gospel, if you read Revelation it is there.

Do not blindly believe the person, check with Scripture.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 75409848


Paul also warned about false gospels and satan being "like an angel of light."

Which is really darkness...

JW's have a different gospel, so do Mormons.
Achduke7

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Re: Gospel of Salvation vs Tribulation Gospel


We must rightly divide the Word of Truth.

God bless
 Quoting: Christian 73629321


Still waiting for the difference. They are the same gospel. There is only one gospel.
Achduke
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We must rightly divide the Word of Truth.

God bless
 Quoting: Christian 73629321


Still waiting for the difference. They are the same gospel. There is only one gospel.
 Quoting: Achduke7


Jesus preached the Gospel of the Kingdom, did that involve believing in his death, burial and resurrection? He had not died yet.


John the Baptist and Jesus preached the Gospel of the Kingdom, to Israel alone. Israel had to believe in the name of Jesus, as their Christ and Messiah. Water baptism was part of this, for Je ws and people of Israel.

Later in Acts and through Paul we see the Apostles preaching the Gospel of Salvation. Faith in the finished work of Christ on the cross. Faith in His blood alone. Romans 3:25

God deals with Israel and Gentiles differently