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Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.

 
freedomsnotfree1

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05/27/2020 07:47 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
That wasn't the question... the question is...

isn't it possible GOD has revealed things to MILLIONS of believers and opened there eyes to this understanding... but not your's, is that possible?

is that a possibility...? yes or no
 Quoting: freedomsnotfree1


The reason that poster cannot truthfully answer that question is because his pride will not allow for it.
Some Christians are not teachable.
They will not humble themselves to be corrected.

Or, maybe.. certain men and women are veiled or blinded and unable to see and hear certain things that the Holy Spirit reveals in Scripture.
God may have purposed for them to be left behind.

They could never see or hear what the Holy Spirit revealed.
Was it because they were never truly Born Again?
Did they have pride or a hardened heart?

Since the time is so very short.. until the rapture... that poster will have to decide if he has been wrong this entire time or continue to defend his stubborn position.

He has very little time left.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 71793015


Time is short for sure! I was taught post-trib and only last year did I fully embrace pre-trib rapture. After much study and prayer, God revealed the truth and opened my eyes.

What hurts is the hateful condemnation from Christians who don't agree. I think they are not meant to be part of this first blessing. They have a purpose to be left behind.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78450412


they aren't Christians ... ALL Christians will be raptured ... those left behind will be tribulation saints or the martyrs under the alter... just my belief ... praise GOD for opening your understanding ...
freedomsnotfree1
freedomsnotfree1

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05/27/2020 09:32 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
...


I don't know why they don't see it pride, preconceived notions, arrogance ... maybe they're meant for tribulation, I pray GOD will take away their scales, those years will be awful. But, once you see it, you know and so many things begin to fall into place... only the Holy Spirit can do that...

I don't THINK I'm going to be raptured... I KNOW it, as all members of the body of Christ know it... because the Holy Spirit has showed us...

and yes, I believe time is very short, it's all coming together... the blessed hope...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77237285


How many saints are destined for the tribulation?

Answer so many they cannot he counted. What makes anyone who believes they are destined for a pretrib-raptute believe they are greater than the saints of tribulation who cannot be counted?

How many can be counted? Revelation counts up to 400,000,000 horseman so the uncountable saints must he a lot higher like a billion or more.

Rev 7:9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands,

Rev 7:14 And I said to him, "Sir, you know." So he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
 Quoting: Achduke7

There will be a great multitude of people who witness the event of the rapture, who will not believe the Satanic lies about a mass alien abduction of all the Christians, or the New Age lies about the earth ascending to a higher vibrational state, thus leaving behind all the Christians. And then after seeing the rapture, they realize the Truth of what has happened, and get right with God. When they do, they will become Saints in the Tribulation, aka Tribulation Saints. And most of them will be beheaded for their testimony.

Also others will get saved through the evangelization efforts of those who converted after the rapture, plus the efforts of the 144,000 Israeli virgins who will convert the nation of Israel, or at least a remnant of them. And then there will come the Two Witnesses who will work miracles and do the same. So yes there will be a great multitude who are saved during the Tribulation period. And all of this happens after the rapture of the Church at the end of the Church Age.

Your premise is flawed. Pre-Tribbers don't believe they are any better than anyone. We are all sinners. It's only by grace that we are saved. And it's only by grace that Yahshua(Jesus) will come again to take us home to the place He has prepared for us in heaven. We simply believe what He has promised us, His bride. If this was not the case, He would have told us so. Had He told us something different, we would believe that instead. He spoke it, we believe it. It's a matter of faith.

Many unbelievers and false Christians will witness the disappearance of all the true Christians around the world, and then they will believe. But it will be too late for the rapture of the Church for them, as the Church has already left. Then they will get saved and endure the time of the Tribulation/Daniel's 70th Week/the Time of Jacob's Trouble. And of those new believers, who will be called saints at that time in the Tribulation, who endure to then end, they shall be saved.

And of those new saints in the Tribulation, most will lose their heads, and they will go to heaven since they are saved. And in heaven, they will be given white robes and palm branches. These martyrs will come out of the Great Tribulation (the last 3.5 yrs of the Tribulation) as they are martyred and go to heaven. These will be among the wise virgins who accompany the Bridegroom (Yahshua/Jesus) and His Bride (the Church) into the Wedding Ceremony in heaven. And the foolish virgins, the false believers, will be left outside as the Bridegroom never knew them. Outside of what? Outside of the Wedding Feast in heaven during the Tribulation, and outside of Yahshua's new Millennial Kingdom on earth after His 2nd Coming with His angels and His Bride the Church.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76772160


This is all speculation. Where are your bible verses to back this up? Since we know the most of the Christians are tribulation saints that cannot be numbered that would not leave many Christians to be pre-raptured. They would artifacts lost in the noise of everything else going on. Who would even notice?
 Quoting: Achduke7


everybody in the world that's a "christian" ie: body of Christ, will be raptured... the Holy Spirit in them MUST be removed before the anti-christ can come to power...it's not a some are, some aren't situation... the "age of Grace" has ended once rapture takes place, GOD picks up with the priesthood again under the law, with works and believe, just like it was when Jesus walked with the 12... 144k JEWI*H priests (the priesthood) will be proclaiming the king is coming, and he will be... in 7 years... the gospel of the kingdom...

Last Edited by freedomsnotfree1 on 05/27/2020 09:35 AM
freedomsnotfree1
Achduke7

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05/27/2020 10:25 AM

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
...


How many saints are destined for the tribulation?

Answer so many they cannot he counted. What makes anyone who believes they are destined for a pretrib-raptute believe they are greater than the saints of tribulation who cannot be counted?

How many can be counted? Revelation counts up to 400,000,000 horseman so the uncountable saints must he a lot higher like a billion or more.

Rev 7:9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands,

Rev 7:14 And I said to him, "Sir, you know." So he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
 Quoting: Achduke7

There will be a great multitude of people who witness the event of the rapture, who will not believe the Satanic lies about a mass alien abduction of all the Christians, or the New Age lies about the earth ascending to a higher vibrational state, thus leaving behind all the Christians. And then after seeing the rapture, they realize the Truth of what has happened, and get right with God. When they do, they will become Saints in the Tribulation, aka Tribulation Saints. And most of them will be beheaded for their testimony.

Also others will get saved through the evangelization efforts of those who converted after the rapture, plus the efforts of the 144,000 Israeli virgins who will convert the nation of Israel, or at least a remnant of them. And then there will come the Two Witnesses who will work miracles and do the same. So yes there will be a great multitude who are saved during the Tribulation period. And all of this happens after the rapture of the Church at the end of the Church Age.

Your premise is flawed. Pre-Tribbers don't believe they are any better than anyone. We are all sinners. It's only by grace that we are saved. And it's only by grace that Yahshua(Jesus) will come again to take us home to the place He has prepared for us in heaven. We simply believe what He has promised us, His bride. If this was not the case, He would have told us so. Had He told us something different, we would believe that instead. He spoke it, we believe it. It's a matter of faith.

Many unbelievers and false Christians will witness the disappearance of all the true Christians around the world, and then they will believe. But it will be too late for the rapture of the Church for them, as the Church has already left. Then they will get saved and endure the time of the Tribulation/Daniel's 70th Week/the Time of Jacob's Trouble. And of those new believers, who will be called saints at that time in the Tribulation, who endure to then end, they shall be saved.

And of those new saints in the Tribulation, most will lose their heads, and they will go to heaven since they are saved. And in heaven, they will be given white robes and palm branches. These martyrs will come out of the Great Tribulation (the last 3.5 yrs of the Tribulation) as they are martyred and go to heaven. These will be among the wise virgins who accompany the Bridegroom (Yahshua/Jesus) and His Bride (the Church) into the Wedding Ceremony in heaven. And the foolish virgins, the false believers, will be left outside as the Bridegroom never knew them. Outside of what? Outside of the Wedding Feast in heaven during the Tribulation, and outside of Yahshua's new Millennial Kingdom on earth after His 2nd Coming with His angels and His Bride the Church.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76772160


This is all speculation. Where are your bible verses to back this up? Since we know the most of the Christians are tribulation saints that cannot be numbered that would not leave many Christians to be pre-raptured. They would artifacts lost in the noise of everything else going on. Who would even notice?
 Quoting: Achduke7


everybody in the world that's a "christian" ie: body of Christ, will be raptured... the Holy Spirit in them MUST be removed before the anti-christ can come to power...it's not a some are, some aren't situation... the "age of Grace" has ended once rapture takes place, GOD picks up with the priesthood again under the law, with works and believe, just like it was when Jesus walked with the 12... 144k JEWI*H priests (the priesthood) will be proclaiming the king is coming, and he will be... in 7 years... the gospel of the kingdom...
 Quoting: freedomsnotfree1


Where in scripture does it say the Holy Spirit must be removed before the anti-christ can come to power? Where is there scripture that proves anything your are speculating on?

Everything in Revelation says the tribulation is 3.5 years long and not 7 years.

The Holy Spirit is still around during the tribulation because the 144K are sealed(Holy Spirit) along with the 2 Witnesses and everyone else that comes to believe in Christ during the tribulation.

Last Edited by Achduke7 on 05/27/2020 11:16 AM
Achduke
Judethz  (OP)
Israel is Eternal

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05/27/2020 11:12 AM

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
There will be a great multitude of people who witness the event of the rapture, who will not believe the Satanic lies about a mass alien abduction of all the Christians, or the New Age lies about the earth ascending to a higher vibrational state, thus leaving behind all the Christians. And then after seeing the rapture, they realize the Truth of what has happened, and get right with God. When they do, they will become Saints in the Tribulation, aka Tribulation Saints. And most of them will be beheaded for their testimony.

Also others will get saved through the evangelization efforts of those who converted after the rapture, plus the efforts of the 144,000 Israeli virgins who will convert the nation of Israel, or at least a remnant of them. And then there will come the Two Witnesses who will work miracles and do the same. So yes there will be a great multitude who are saved during the Tribulation period. And all of this happens after the rapture of the Church at the end of the Church Age.

Your premise is flawed. Pre-Tribbers don't believe they are any better than anyone. We are all sinners. It's only by grace that we are saved. And it's only by grace that Yahshua(Jesus) will come again to take us home to the place He has prepared for us in heaven. We simply believe what He has promised us, His bride. If this was not the case, He would have told us so. Had He told us something different, we would believe that instead. He spoke it, we believe it. It's a matter of faith.

Many unbelievers and false Christians will witness the disappearance of all the true Christians around the world, and then they will believe. But it will be too late for the rapture of the Church for them, as the Church has already left. Then they will get saved and endure the time of the Tribulation/Daniel's 70th Week/the Time of Jacob's Trouble. And of those new believers, who will be called saints at that time in the Tribulation, who endure to then end, they shall be saved.

And of those new saints in the Tribulation, most will lose their heads, and they will go to heaven since they are saved. And in heaven, they will be given white robes and palm branches. These martyrs will come out of the Great Tribulation (the last 3.5 yrs of the Tribulation) as they are martyred and go to heaven. These will be among the wise virgins who accompany the Bridegroom (Yahshua/Jesus) and His Bride (the Church) into the Wedding Ceremony in heaven. And the foolish virgins, the false believers, will be left outside as the Bridegroom never knew them. Outside of what? Outside of the Wedding Feast in heaven during the Tribulation, and outside of Yahshua's new Millennial Kingdom on earth after His 2nd Coming with His angels and His Bride the Church.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76772160


What a bunch of HUMAN theological SCHOLAR BABBLE.

The SAME type of CRAP that CONVINCED folks of the false doctrine to BEGIN with.

NO comparison of what Paul says to what Jesus says.

NOT even ONE single Bible verse.

NOTHING but "scholar speak" - the same type of crap that universities have been spoonfeeding young non-believers for the last 40 years.


 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


white3 Your angry reaction to someone who is speaking the truth is quite telling. I also note your clever use of the 'Witchcraft 101' technique of slandering believers and telling outright lies. One day you will have to answer for all of this.
Judethz  (OP)
Israel is Eternal

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05/27/2020 11:19 AM

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
Where in scripture does it say the Holy Spirit must be removed before the anti-christ can come to power? Where is there scripture that proves anything your are speculating on?

 Quoting: Achduke7


white1 2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
...

There will be a great multitude of people who witness the event of the rapture, who will not believe the Satanic lies about a mass alien abduction of all the Christians, or the New Age lies about the earth ascending to a higher vibrational state, thus leaving behind all the Christians. And then after seeing the rapture, they realize the Truth of what has happened, and get right with God. When they do, they will become Saints in the Tribulation, aka Tribulation Saints. And most of them will be beheaded for their testimony.

Also others will get saved through the evangelization efforts of those who converted after the rapture, plus the efforts of the 144,000 Israeli virgins who will convert the nation of Israel, or at least a remnant of them. And then there will come the Two Witnesses who will work miracles and do the same. So yes there will be a great multitude who are saved during the Tribulation period. And all of this happens after the rapture of the Church at the end of the Church Age.

Your premise is flawed. Pre-Tribbers don't believe they are any better than anyone. We are all sinners. It's only by grace that we are saved. And it's only by grace that Yahshua(Jesus) will come again to take us home to the place He has prepared for us in heaven. We simply believe what He has promised us, His bride. If this was not the case, He would have told us so. Had He told us something different, we would believe that instead. He spoke it, we believe it. It's a matter of faith.

Many unbelievers and false Christians will witness the disappearance of all the true Christians around the world, and then they will believe. But it will be too late for the rapture of the Church for them, as the Church has already left. Then they will get saved and endure the time of the Tribulation/Daniel's 70th Week/the Time of Jacob's Trouble. And of those new believers, who will be called saints at that time in the Tribulation, who endure to then end, they shall be saved.

And of those new saints in the Tribulation, most will lose their heads, and they will go to heaven since they are saved. And in heaven, they will be given white robes and palm branches. These martyrs will come out of the Great Tribulation (the last 3.5 yrs of the Tribulation) as they are martyred and go to heaven. These will be among the wise virgins who accompany the Bridegroom (Yahshua/Jesus) and His Bride (the Church) into the Wedding Ceremony in heaven. And the foolish virgins, the false believers, will be left outside as the Bridegroom never knew them. Outside of what? Outside of the Wedding Feast in heaven during the Tribulation, and outside of Yahshua's new Millennial Kingdom on earth after His 2nd Coming with His angels and His Bride the Church.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76772160


This is all speculation. Where are your bible verses to back this up? Since we know the most of the Christians are tribulation saints that cannot be numbered that would not leave many Christians to be pre-raptured. They would artifacts lost in the noise of everything else going on. Who would even notice?
 Quoting: Achduke7


everybody in the world that's a "christian" ie: body of Christ, will be raptured... the Holy Spirit in them MUST be removed before the anti-christ can come to power...it's not a some are, some aren't situation... the "age of Grace" has ended once rapture takes place, GOD picks up with the priesthood again under the law, with works and believe, just like it was when Jesus walked with the 12... 144k JEWI*H priests (the priesthood) will be proclaiming the king is coming, and he will be... in 7 years... the gospel of the kingdom...
 Quoting: freedomsnotfree1


Where in scripture does it say the Holy Spirit must be removed before the anti-christ can come to power? Where is there scripture that proves anything your are speculating on?

Everything in Revelation says the tribulation is 3.5 years long and not 7 years.

The Holy Spirit is still around during the tribulation because the 144K are sealed(Holy Spirit) along with the 2 Witnesses and everyone else that comes to believe in Christ during the tribulation.
 Quoting: Achduke7


2 Thess 2:3

"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a departing first, and that that man of sin be disclosed, even the son of perdition."

body of Christ departing FIRST, then the anti-christ is revealed...
Achduke7

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
Where in scripture does it say the Holy Spirit must be removed before the anti-christ can come to power? Where is there scripture that proves anything your are speculating on?

 Quoting: Achduke7


white1 2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
 Quoting: Judethz


The "he" is not specified in 2Th 2:7 so it is a pre-trib assumption that it is the Holy Spirit. Nothing in 2 Thess suggests the Holy Spirit that I can see. The Holy Spirit is not even mentioned in 2 Thessalonians. The restrainer could even be Michael as mentioned in Revelation and Daniel who casts out satan.

Rev 12:7-9 7 Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. 8 But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 9 The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
Achduke
Achduke7

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
...


This is all speculation. Where are your bible verses to back this up? Since we know the most of the Christians are tribulation saints that cannot be numbered that would not leave many Christians to be pre-raptured. They would artifacts lost in the noise of everything else going on. Who would even notice?
 Quoting: Achduke7


everybody in the world that's a "christian" ie: body of Christ, will be raptured... the Holy Spirit in them MUST be removed before the anti-christ can come to power...it's not a some are, some aren't situation... the "age of Grace" has ended once rapture takes place, GOD picks up with the priesthood again under the law, with works and believe, just like it was when Jesus walked with the 12... 144k JEWI*H priests (the priesthood) will be proclaiming the king is coming, and he will be... in 7 years... the gospel of the kingdom...
 Quoting: freedomsnotfree1


Where in scripture does it say the Holy Spirit must be removed before the anti-christ can come to power? Where is there scripture that proves anything your are speculating on?

Everything in Revelation says the tribulation is 3.5 years long and not 7 years.

The Holy Spirit is still around during the tribulation because the 144K are sealed(Holy Spirit) along with the 2 Witnesses and everyone else that comes to believe in Christ during the tribulation.
 Quoting: Achduke7


2 Thess 2:3

"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a departing first, and that that man of sin be disclosed, even the son of perdition."

body of Christ departing FIRST, then the anti-christ is revealed...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77237285


That is not what the King James says.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Also the body of Christ does not gather to Christ until these things happen.

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
Achduke
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
...


everybody in the world that's a "christian" ie: body of Christ, will be raptured... the Holy Spirit in them MUST be removed before the anti-christ can come to power...it's not a some are, some aren't situation... the "age of Grace" has ended once rapture takes place, GOD picks up with the priesthood again under the law, with works and believe, just like it was when Jesus walked with the 12... 144k JEWI*H priests (the priesthood) will be proclaiming the king is coming, and he will be... in 7 years... the gospel of the kingdom...
 Quoting: freedomsnotfree1


Where in scripture does it say the Holy Spirit must be removed before the anti-christ can come to power? Where is there scripture that proves anything your are speculating on?

Everything in Revelation says the tribulation is 3.5 years long and not 7 years.

The Holy Spirit is still around during the tribulation because the 144K are sealed(Holy Spirit) along with the 2 Witnesses and everyone else that comes to believe in Christ during the tribulation.
 Quoting: Achduke7


2 Thess 2:3

"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a departing first, and that that man of sin be disclosed, even the son of perdition."

body of Christ departing FIRST, then the anti-christ is revealed...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77237285


That is not what the King James says.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Also the body of Christ does not gather to Christ until these things happen.

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
 Quoting: Achduke7


I use the Geneva 1599 bible ... outlawed by King James, he wrote his version 15 years later... doesn't change the context however ... a departure or falling away (rapture) FIRST and THEN the son of perdition is revealed...
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
...


everybody in the world that's a "christian" ie: body of Christ, will be raptured... the Holy Spirit in them MUST be removed before the anti-christ can come to power...it's not a some are, some aren't situation... the "age of Grace" has ended once rapture takes place, GOD picks up with the priesthood again under the law, with works and believe, just like it was when Jesus walked with the 12... 144k JEWI*H priests (the priesthood) will be proclaiming the king is coming, and he will be... in 7 years... the gospel of the kingdom...
 Quoting: freedomsnotfree1


Where in scripture does it say the Holy Spirit must be removed before the anti-christ can come to power? Where is there scripture that proves anything your are speculating on?

Everything in Revelation says the tribulation is 3.5 years long and not 7 years.

The Holy Spirit is still around during the tribulation because the 144K are sealed(Holy Spirit) along with the 2 Witnesses and everyone else that comes to believe in Christ during the tribulation.
 Quoting: Achduke7


2 Thess 2:3

"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a departing first, and that that man of sin be disclosed, even the son of perdition."

body of Christ departing FIRST, then the anti-christ is revealed...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77237285


That is not what the King James says.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Also the body of Christ does not gather to Christ until these things happen.

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
 Quoting: Achduke7

It is true that the Greek word 'apostasia' in the KJV was not translated into 'departure' but instead into 'falling away'. And the newer translations of the bible also don't translate it this way either, but use other words.

But the oldest of the English bible translations, those translated before the 1611 KJV translate 'apostasia' as a 'departure'. And I think that is the more correct translation of this word.

Here is some additional research that discusses better than I can why this word 'departure' is likely to be the better translation:

Is the Rapture in 2 Thessalonians 2:3?
[link to www.focusonjerusalem.com]

2 Thessalonians 2:3 Can the Rapture be found in this passage?
[link to christinprophecy.org (secure)]

The Departure Of 2 Thessalonians 2:3
[link to prophecyupdate.blogspot.com (secure)]

Also, Paul is saying in 2 Thess 2:1-3 that he is talking about the gathering together of believers to Christ. And he is saying not to be worried that you have found yourself IN the 'Day of the Lord', as in the Tribulation/Daniel's 70th Week/the Time of Jacob's Trouble. He says we will depart first before that happens. And that the Holy Spirit restrainer will be taken out of the way before that Day comes. And THEN the Antichrist will be revealed. He's saying (to paraphrase) 'Hey, I told you before that these things would happen before the tribulation: that we would depart, that the Holy Spirit will depart with us, and that only then after that will that Day come. So why are you worried? Don't listen to the Post-tribbers.'
Servant-of-the-LORD

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05/27/2020 03:31 PM

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
What a bunch of HUMAN theological SCHOLAR BABBLE.

The SAME type of CRAP that CONVINCED folks of the false doctrine to BEGIN with.

NO comparison of what Paul says to what Jesus says.

NOT even ONE single Bible verse.

NOTHING but "scholar speak" - the same type of crap that universities have been spoonfeeding young non-believers for the last 40 years.


 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


white3: Your angry reaction to someone who is speaking the truth is quite telling. I also note your clever use of the 'Witchcraft 101' technique of slandering believers and telling outright lies. One day you will have to answer for all of this.
 Quoting: Judethz


Angry? lol NOPE.

Emphatic YES.

You and "freedomsnotfree" started the slandering way back.

WHY do you suppose there are 33,000+ various Christian denominations?

"Paul only for gentiles" is just a few of them.

tantrum
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Servant-of-the-LORD

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05/27/2020 03:43 PM

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
Where in scripture does it say the Holy Spirit must be removed before the anti-christ can come to power? Where is there scripture that proves anything your are speculating on?

 Quoting: Achduke7


white1: 2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
 Quoting: Judethz


The "he" is not specified in 2Th 2:7 so it is a pre-trib assumption that it is the Holy Spirit. Nothing in 2 Thess suggests the Holy Spirit that I can see. The Holy Spirit is not even mentioned in 2 Thessalonians. The restrainer could even be Michael as mentioned in Revelation and Daniel who casts out satan.

Rev 12:7-9 7 Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. 8 But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 9 The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
 Quoting: Achduke7


Michael as the "restrainer" makes sense.

Neither Father God, nor Jesus nor the Holy Spirit will leave Believers defenseless during the tribulation.
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Servant-of-the-LORD

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05/27/2020 03:46 PM

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
That is not what the King James says.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Also the body of Christ does not gather to Christ until these things happen.

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
 Quoting: Achduke7


I use the Geneva 1599 bible ... outlawed by King James, he wrote his version 15 years later... doesn't change the context however ... a departure or falling away (rapture) FIRST and THEN the son of perdition is revealed...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 77237285


There is no "perfect" Bible.

The departure / falling away is "away from sound doctines" or even belief.

SOME folks who once believed in a "rapture" would be part of that group. No rapture happening would cause many to lose their faith.
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Judethz  (OP)
Israel is Eternal

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05/27/2020 03:54 PM

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
WHY do you suppose there are 33,000+ various Christian denominations?

"Paul only for gentiles" is just a few of them.

 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


white5 I don't know, I haven't really thought about it. But God works in mysterious ways and if, as you say, there are around 33,000 various Christian denomination's I'm sure that there is a good reason for it, that will be revealed in due time.

The "Paul only for gentiles" argument is something that you keep harping on about in post after post. So why are you doing an about turn and implying that I have some kind of problem with Paul/Saul? I would suppose that during his lifetime Paul would preach the gospel to anyone who would listen.
Angel_Eyes

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05/27/2020 05:18 PM

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
It's a shame...they criticise Christians because we believe the Bible.....yet they believe in Aliens....its laughable if it wasn't so sad.....
Judethz  (OP)
Israel is Eternal

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
SOME folks who once believed in a "rapture" would be part of that group. No rapture happening would cause many to lose their faith.
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


white3 On the other hand the Rapture happening would cause many lukewarm Christians and other people

to find their faith and turn to the Lord with all their heart. But what do you know you're just a modern day Pharisee full of dry, dead arguments, that suck the life out of those who listen to you.
Anonymous Coward
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05/27/2020 11:54 PM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
Revelation 3:10 (KJV)
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

That is the 'Blessed Hope!'

Titus 2:13 (KJV)
13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Yahshua(Jesus) Christ

Maranatha!

Peace.


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76772160
Servant-of-the-LORD

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05/28/2020 12:17 AM

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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
WHY do you suppose there are 33,000+ various Christian denominations?

"Paul only for gentiles" is just a few of them.
 Quoting: Servant-of-the-LORD


white5: I don't know, I haven't really thought about it. But God works in mysterious ways and if, as you say, there are around 33,000 various Christian denomination's I'm sure that there is a good reason for it, that will be revealed in due time.
 Quoting: Judethz

"Good reason"? As Paul said "Is Christ divided"?

From this website...

[link to hirr.hartsem.edu]

"However, since the RCMS 2010 study we now know that the grouping of nondenominational churches, if taken together, would be the second largest Protestant group in the country with over 35,000 independent or nondenominational churches representing more than 12,200,000 adherents. These nondenominational churches are present in every state and in 2,663 out of the total of 3,033 counties in the country, or 88% of the total."

[link to thecompletepilgrim.com (secure)]

"According to quora.com, the estimated number of church buildings accommodating Christian congregations is approximately 37 million. That’s one for every 65 people. The same website indicates that there are 34,000 Christian denominations in the world (we’ll get back to that in a bit)."

Last Edited by Servant-of-the-LORD on 05/28/2020 12:18 AM
I am a humble Servant of the one True Living God.
Anonymous Coward
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05/28/2020 12:20 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
Men disagree..
Anonymous Coward
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05/28/2020 12:21 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
It's a shame...they criticise Christians because we believe the Bible.....yet they believe in Aliens....its laughable if it wasn't so sad.....
 Quoting: Angel_Eyes


Yet the book of enoch is all about aliens and ufo wars, nuclear wars.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
It's a shame...they criticise Christians because we believe the Bible.....yet they believe in Aliens....its laughable if it wasn't so sad.....
 Quoting: Angel_Eyes


Hate Christians.

Believe aliens..

devil6
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05/28/2020 12:22 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
War in heaven with Michael and the dragon was a ufo war in space with humans vs reptilians.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
It's a shame...they criticise Christians because we believe the Bible.....yet they believe in Aliens....its laughable if it wasn't so sad.....
 Quoting: Angel_Eyes


Hate Christians.

Believe aliens..

devil6
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78960767


Humans have 22 different extraterrestrial DNA in them, and ET humans seeded life on Earth just as we will see life on other planets.
Anonymous Coward
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05/28/2020 12:23 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
It's a shame...they criticise Christians because we believe the Bible.....yet they believe in Aliens....its laughable if it wasn't so sad.....
 Quoting: Angel_Eyes


Yet the book of enoch is all about aliens and ufo wars, nuclear wars.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78882220


There are no "aliens".

You have ZERO evidence they are from ANYWHERE else, yet you BELIEVE that...

They have always been HERE and appeared to all civilizations across the earth over all of human history.

Why would they lie to you?

hmm
Anonymous Coward
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05/28/2020 12:25 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
At the time of the war, with a world in chaos, and when millions have disappeared, the "aliens" make their grand arrival appearance, and explain away everything to you, so that you welcome the arrival of the Man of Peace...
Anonymous Coward
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05/28/2020 12:26 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
It's a shame...they criticise Christians because we believe the Bible.....yet they believe in Aliens....its laughable if it wasn't so sad.....
 Quoting: Angel_Eyes


Yet the book of enoch is all about aliens and ufo wars, nuclear wars.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78882220


There are no "aliens".

You have ZERO evidence they are from ANYWHERE else, yet you BELIEVE that...

They have always been HERE and appeared to all civilizations across the earth over all of human history.

Why would they lie to you?

hmm
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78960767


Evidence is everywhere including in our DNA. The pyramids all over the world line up to certain star systems like Orion.

Pharoah Akhenaten aka Moses sure looked like an alien with his huge elongated skull.

Most ET's are human and they could be living next to you and you wouldn't know the difference.

Humans on Earth come from Lyra, Vega, Pleiades, Sirius, Andromeda, and etc.

Asians are 1/4 grey alien (vril) and 3/4 human.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
Genesis 1:26

Then God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness

If God was a single entity it wouldn't be plural saying OUR.

It's multiple beings.
Anonymous Coward
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05/28/2020 12:28 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
At the time of the war, with a world in chaos, and when millions have disappeared, the "aliens" make their grand arrival appearance, and explain away everything to you, so that you welcome the arrival of the Man of Peace...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 78960767


Man of Peace is already here. ET's met with Eisenhower and said they would bring world peace if we all agreed to disarm our nuclear arms, he told them to fuck off.

Instead he made an agreement with grey aliens so they could abduct humans for research in exchange for computers and mind control technologies to use against humans.
Anonymous Coward
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05/28/2020 12:29 AM
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
The "aliens" never preach Jesus Christ.

The "aliens" flee at Faith in the Name of Jesus Christ...

There are many accounts substantiating this to any reasonable satisfaction.

Draw your own conclusion...
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Why the Rapture may be sooner than many people think.
...


How many saints are destined for the tribulation?

Answer so many they cannot he counted. What makes anyone who believes they are destined for a pretrib-raptute believe they are greater than the saints of tribulation who cannot be counted?

How many can be counted? Revelation counts up to 400,000,000 horseman so the uncountable saints must he a lot higher like a billion or more.

Rev 7:9 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands,

Rev 7:14 And I said to him, "Sir, you know." So he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
 Quoting: Achduke7

There will be a great multitude of people who witness the event of the rapture, who will not believe the Satanic lies about a mass alien abduction of all the Christians, or the New Age lies about the earth ascending to a higher vibrational state, thus leaving behind all the Christians. And then after seeing the rapture, they realize the Truth of what has happened, and get right with God. When they do, they will become Saints in the Tribulation, aka Tribulation Saints. And most of them will be beheaded for their testimony.

Also others will get saved through the evangelization efforts of those who converted after the rapture, plus the efforts of the 144,000 Israeli virgins who will convert the nation of Israel, or at least a remnant of them. And then there will come the Two Witnesses who will work miracles and do the same. So yes there will be a great multitude who are saved during the Tribulation period. And all of this happens after the rapture of the Church at the end of the Church Age.

Your premise is flawed. Pre-Tribbers don't believe they are any better than anyone. We are all sinners. It's only by grace that we are saved. And it's only by grace that Yahshua(Jesus) will come again to take us home to the place He has prepared for us in heaven. We simply believe what He has promised us, His bride. If this was not the case, He would have told us so. Had He told us something different, we would believe that instead. He spoke it, we believe it. It's a matter of faith.

Many unbelievers and false Christians will witness the disappearance of all the true Christians around the world, and then they will believe. But it will be too late for the rapture of the Church for them, as the Church has already left. Then they will get saved and endure the time of the Tribulation/Daniel's 70th Week/the Time of Jacob's Trouble. And of those new believers, who will be called saints at that time in the Tribulation, who endure to then end, they shall be saved.

And of those new saints in the Tribulation, most will lose their heads, and they will go to heaven since they are saved. And in heaven, they will be given white robes and palm branches. These martyrs will come out of the Great Tribulation (the last 3.5 yrs of the Tribulation) as they are martyred and go to heaven. These will be among the wise virgins who accompany the Bridegroom (Yahshua/Jesus) and His Bride (the Church) into the Wedding Ceremony in heaven. And the foolish virgins, the false believers, will be left outside as the Bridegroom never knew them. Outside of what? Outside of the Wedding Feast in heaven during the Tribulation, and outside of Yahshua's new Millennial Kingdom on earth after His 2nd Coming with His angels and His Bride the Church.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 76772160


This is all speculation. Where are your bible verses to back this up? Since we know the most of the Christians are tribulation saints that cannot be numbered that would not leave many Christians to be pre-raptured. They would artifacts lost in the noise of everything else going on. Who would even notice?
 Quoting: Achduke7


everybody in the world that's a "christian" ie: body of Christ, will be raptured... the Holy Spirit in them MUST be removed before the anti-christ can come to power...it's not a some are, some aren't situation... the "age of Grace" has ended once rapture takes place, GOD picks up with the priesthood again under the law, with works and believe, just like it was when Jesus walked with the 12... 144k JEWI*H priests (the priesthood) will be proclaiming the king is coming, and he will be... in 7 years... the gospel of the kingdom...
 Quoting: freedomsnotfree1


Rapture means bliss, the whole "rapture" idea of being taken off Earth wasnt invented until 1800s by some man.





GLP