If Jesus was with God and was God in the beginning why does the bible say he is God's first creation?

Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip

just copied and pasted came up with John 14:9

Jesus NEVER claims to be God Himself. How many times does He say Father?





And you trinitarians try to claim Jesus is equal TO the Father, which Jesus plainly states that He IS NOT.

Trinitarianism is a cult that took over just after Tertullian in the 2nd century. Look him up.



Nope. They don't. Trinitarian nonsense.

Thread: Son of God - Jesus' Relationship To The Father - John 17 and More - Bible Study

Here. Maybe you would like to spin this to discredit God. DGN seems to be busy, or stumped.


Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?

Man seen the Father via " The Son of Man" the Father was inside the mortal flesh that he "sent" thus, God in the flesh.

Discredit God? You folks do that by claiming His SON IS God.

Jesus' reply to Phillip is taken out of context.

Look at Jesus talking to & praying to the Father in John 17.

John 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

Right... you just proved the point with the scripture you cited. I knew you would.

Don't have time to break it down like a child for you, but will circle back after a while

TLS you haven't replied to my reply? maybe you missed it last post on page 7

Nothing you say will change my stance that posting Bible verses without proper correct "book & chapter" information is wrong. ANYONE who teaches out of the Bible begins with "Open your Bibles and go to...(book and chapter)".

Forcing someone to copy a snippet of verse to find where it is ...is nothing more than plain lazyness and downright rude.

Don't bother. There's NOTHING in scripture that will prove your doctrine to be correct.

I'm 60+ years old. I had a human Dad & Mom, and have one Father in heaven...who has a SON named Yeshua / Jesus.

TLS since you left this part out of your response I will ask again
this shows he had that glory with the father before the world was. How does it prove it was The Heavenly Fathers own?

Revelation 21:23 23The city does not need the sun or the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and the Lamb is its lamp

please break this scripture down

the lamp is it not the carrier of Light?

Moses ask to see Gods Glory he showed him Light without a carrier?

John 10:33“We are not stoning You for any good work,” said the Jews, “but for blasphemy, because You, who are a man, declare Yourself to be God.” 34Jesus replied, “Is it not written in your Law: ‘I have said you are gods’? 35If he called them gods to whom the word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken—

Psalm 82:6
I have said, "You are gods; you are all sons of the Most High

Don't Stone Jesus

Colossians 1:12
giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified you to share in the inheritance of the saints in the light.

Colossians 1:13
He has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of His beloved Son,

Now that's a POWER post!

YOUR IF.....is not based on Bible.....

Jhn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Word = LOGOS not Jesus


Amen is not Jesus.... amen means 'so be it'.....

LOGOS is the beginning........IT is the 'so be it'...verified in Gen. 1 when it is written.....

God said, 'let there be light' ...... let as in 'so be it' ....

Whose Jehovah?

Actually this is incorrect, the bible didn't come to be all at once, it started with the pentateuch, that means that those 5 books existed and had to justify each other at the time...Much later when the hebrews went into captivity the rest was added, the prophets major and minor and this become the OT...Now, that has to exist without the NT for thousands of years.

So these aspects can be judged as such keeping this in mind when excercising hermaneutics in your studies..

Jehova is a 16th century translation of the tetragrammatton from greek to latin by franciscan monks that decide its should be pronouced jehova as opposed to yahweh, Amens etymology isn't "so be it" its the name of the Egyptian god amun ra...This was inserted into christianity, it is correct the word logos is what is written in the greek with regards to John, however this is a mistranslation from logos to "word" Logos means much more...

Jesus was not God, the father and he were one but he was not the fatrher, same as leaf is one with the tree but it is not the tree... The chritianity you have today is in error, it was deestroyed almost as soon as it was born...You have to go real deep into the rabbit hole to find what these guys hid!! Let me tell you even Jesus siad woe be unto you scribe!! that means even in his day they were fuckin with scripture...

Good luck

You missed the above? John 17 5 & 22.

If you are open minded you can ask God to point you in the direction to go,seek and you will find.you are asking a good question.I am glad you are an inteligent person.God is a mystery to us humans,who are limited in our understanding.some things in thBible are a mystery.Jeremiah 29 verse 13,says if "you seek God with all your heart you will find Him".All this information can also be ahelp to others out there who have these kind of questions

And you missed Isaiah 42:8

"I am the LORD, that is My name; I will not give My glory to another, Nor My praise to graven images.

Your turn!

Easy.

Statement was made "pre-Jesus" - before Jesus was introduced to the world stage. Totally appropriate for that point in time.

It's also possible that since Jesus IS the Son OF God - that He had His own glory - but lost it temporarily while being born of a human on earth. Maybe the "Transfiguration" was the Father giving it back to Jesus for a few moments to show the difference between Him and Moses / Elijah.

I didn't miss it I reposted it and underlined the part about having the Glory before the World was

Yes John 17:22 states Jesus got the glory from his father

that would be Jesus born appx 2000 years ago not the word or the light of the world

[link to scriptoriumdaily.com]


Mic drop!!!!

Did Jehovah create Jesus?

Jesus and the Apostles STOMP on your mic

Here's over 400 verses where Jesus and the Apostles declare the Father etc...
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The word "Father" occurs 250 times in 212 verses in Matthew thru John in the KJV.

[link to www.blueletterbible.org (secure)]

Of those 250 times, there are 224 verses where either Jesus or the Apostles refer to the "Father" - God.
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The phrase "my Father" occurs 56 times in 53 verses, all in the 4 Gospels & Revelation in the KJV.

[link to www.blueletterbible.org (secure)]
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The phrase "the Father" occurs 143 times in 125 verses in the New Testament in the KJV.

[link to www.blueletterbible.org (secure)]

Jesus uses the phrase "the Father" 59 times
The Apostles use it another 50 times
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The phrase "our Father" 19 verses in the KJV

The phrase "your Father" 15 verses in the 4 Gospels

The phrase "thy Father" 3 verses in Matthew

The phrase "heavenly Father" 6 verses in the 4 Gospels

Jesus uses just the word "Father" 19 verses in the 4 Gospels

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Jesus states that He was "SENT" 47 times in the 4 Gospels

[link to www.blueletterbible.org (secure)]
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The phrase "Son of God" is used 28 times in the 4 Gospels
The phrase "Son of God" is used 19 times in Acts thru Revelation

[link to www.blueletterbible.org (secure)]
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The phrase "kingdom of God" (NOT "MY kingdom") is used 54 times in the 4 Gospels

[link to www.blueletterbible.org (secure)]

Last Edited by Servant-of-the-LORD on 02/20/2019 11:31 PM

Matthew 1:18
This is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about: His mother Mary was pledged in marriage to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be with Child through the Holy Spirit


Luke 1 …34“How can this be,” Mary asked the angel, “since I am a virgin?” 35The angel replied, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the Holy One to be born will be called the Son of God.



Is the power of the Most High the Most High or his power?

Your obviously not the sharpest tool in the shed.

The statement was not pre-Jesus. Hiw do we know this?

Jesus had Glory before the world was created.

John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

So, your assertion that the statement was Pre-Jesus is as foolish as the rest of your assertions concerning who God really is.

Wow, that's some funny shit. So who are "the chosen ones" oh master of Bible teaching.

Those that argue are clueless to the fact the Logos(Word) lived with God before "the beginning. Several scriptures show this.

Before we go down that rabbit hole to exercise your need to poke at Biblical facts......

do you agree with my premise that your question is faulty at is basic thought.....if you don't agree with my answer?

He will tell you the chosen ones are 144,000 Jehovah's witnesses, which includes it's Governing body members who actively fight the legal system, demanding its their right to protect Child molesters and not turn over their documented list to authorities that keep on file of all the known baby rapist in their congregation. That's a fact and public court records show their pleading to protect the privacy of the molesters and even though courts have ordered they turn over their files, they defy the courts, spending MILLIONS OF $$$ from their sheep who donate to their cause to fight to protect and shield the pedifiles from prosecution.